0 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:30,000 Dear viewer, these subtitles were generated by a machine via the service Trint and therefore are (very) buggy. If you are capable, please help us to create good quality subtitles: https://c3subtitles.de/talk/36 Thanks! 1 00:00:15,310 --> 00:00:17,679 So today we want to talk to you 2 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:19,779 about the 3 00:00:19,780 --> 00:00:22,359 role of technology and society 4 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:24,699 in the longer arc 5 00:00:24,700 --> 00:00:25,750 of human history. 6 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:30,039 We'd like to take you. We'd like you all 7 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:31,719 to take a couple of things away from this 8 00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:32,720 talk. 9 00:00:35,140 --> 00:00:37,659 The interaction between 10 00:00:37,660 --> 00:00:39,789 a piece of technology and a peace and 11 00:00:39,790 --> 00:00:42,729 and society is rarely settled 12 00:00:42,730 --> 00:00:45,009 in, you know, two or three years 13 00:00:45,010 --> 00:00:46,239 or ten years. 14 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:48,219 We're still, as a society, just barely 15 00:00:48,220 --> 00:00:49,639 learning how to use email. 16 00:00:50,650 --> 00:00:52,899 If you think even in the past five or 10 17 00:00:52,900 --> 00:00:54,789 years, the way emails used in 18 00:00:54,790 --> 00:00:56,319 professional contexts has changed 19 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:57,669 radically, we don't really know what it 20 00:00:57,670 --> 00:00:58,670 means yet. 21 00:01:00,670 --> 00:01:02,379 We think we have a reasonable 22 00:01:02,380 --> 00:01:03,909 understanding of how you use an 23 00:01:03,910 --> 00:01:05,649 auditorium. 24 00:01:05,650 --> 00:01:07,659 We figured that one out. 25 00:01:07,660 --> 00:01:08,660 Mostly 26 00:01:10,510 --> 00:01:12,399 the other thing we'd like to talk about 27 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:13,989 here and we'd like you to take away from 28 00:01:13,990 --> 00:01:16,389 here is that 29 00:01:16,390 --> 00:01:18,459 while geek culture kind of grew 30 00:01:18,460 --> 00:01:21,459 up is an outsider, a culture 31 00:01:21,460 --> 00:01:23,139 that changed. 32 00:01:23,140 --> 00:01:24,549 It's at the heart of politics, in the 33 00:01:24,550 --> 00:01:26,679 heart of social movements now, 34 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:27,939 because it's the heart of how we 35 00:01:27,940 --> 00:01:29,050 communicate now. 36 00:01:31,060 --> 00:01:33,189 Geek culture and hacker culture 37 00:01:33,190 --> 00:01:35,259 used to be relatively apolitical, 38 00:01:35,260 --> 00:01:37,329 but now every action 39 00:01:37,330 --> 00:01:39,519 that you take and every piece of code 40 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:42,249 that you write has political effects. 41 00:01:42,250 --> 00:01:44,199 Now you may intend some of these effects. 42 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:46,749 You may not intend most of these effects, 43 00:01:46,750 --> 00:01:49,059 but they're there and we need to start 44 00:01:49,060 --> 00:01:50,979 thinking about and understanding these 45 00:01:50,980 --> 00:01:52,719 changes. And this is the change that's 46 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:54,249 happened in our lifetimes. 47 00:01:57,100 --> 00:01:58,100 So 48 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:01,479 Quinn is mostly 49 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:03,579 a kind of incoherent blend of 50 00:02:03,580 --> 00:02:05,799 anti-capitalist anarchism in California 51 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:07,679 libertarianism, 52 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:09,758 and Ella is a Marxist in 53 00:02:09,759 --> 00:02:11,289 the class, presumably with blood on her 54 00:02:11,290 --> 00:02:12,969 hands. But since she likes me a lot, 55 00:02:12,970 --> 00:02:14,769 she's promised me six minutes notice on 56 00:02:14,770 --> 00:02:16,419 The Purge before it happened so I can get 57 00:02:16,420 --> 00:02:17,420 a head start. 58 00:02:20,230 --> 00:02:22,059 Despite the political parts of this talk, 59 00:02:22,060 --> 00:02:24,040 this talk is not about our politics, 60 00:02:25,210 --> 00:02:27,669 not about what Ella or 61 00:02:27,670 --> 00:02:29,019 I want you to do. 62 00:02:29,020 --> 00:02:30,579 It's about what we've learned from 63 00:02:30,580 --> 00:02:32,649 examining the network effects that 64 00:02:32,650 --> 00:02:33,650 we live with now 65 00:02:35,260 --> 00:02:37,479 because fundamentally, 66 00:02:37,480 --> 00:02:38,709 many of you will recognize this. 67 00:02:38,710 --> 00:02:39,710 But fundamentally, 68 00:02:40,930 --> 00:02:43,029 architecture has a politics and it 69 00:02:43,030 --> 00:02:44,589 has a culture. 70 00:02:44,590 --> 00:02:46,929 And while we were all kind 71 00:02:46,930 --> 00:02:49,089 of sitting around in our culture 72 00:02:49,090 --> 00:02:51,459 and usenet in the 90s or wherever 73 00:02:51,460 --> 00:02:53,649 we got our start kind of being 74 00:02:53,650 --> 00:02:55,749 like el-Said Outsiders, 75 00:02:55,750 --> 00:02:57,309 the world pivoted. 76 00:02:57,310 --> 00:02:59,409 It changed and surrounded us and put 77 00:02:59,410 --> 00:03:01,389 us at the heart of these matters. 78 00:03:01,390 --> 00:03:03,939 And so whatever you want 79 00:03:03,940 --> 00:03:06,519 to do politically, 80 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:08,529 what we're going to be talking about is 81 00:03:08,530 --> 00:03:10,119 the framework of the politics that 82 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:12,309 technology is creating around 83 00:03:12,310 --> 00:03:13,449 the world right now. 84 00:03:16,430 --> 00:03:18,739 So one of the 85 00:03:18,740 --> 00:03:21,289 one of the really interesting structures 86 00:03:21,290 --> 00:03:22,639 in the world right now that we spend a 87 00:03:22,640 --> 00:03:25,249 lot of time dealing with our states. 88 00:03:25,250 --> 00:03:27,559 States have a couple of very basic things 89 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:29,839 that they require to be able to interact 90 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:30,979 with the world. 91 00:03:30,980 --> 00:03:32,479 They need to be able to see their 92 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:34,579 territory and the people who 93 00:03:34,580 --> 00:03:36,739 live in that territory if they're going 94 00:03:36,740 --> 00:03:39,289 to be able to interact with them. 95 00:03:39,290 --> 00:03:41,599 And this is this is simply a truth 96 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,029 that applies to anything, to any time 97 00:03:44,030 --> 00:03:46,039 where someone needs to interact with the 98 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:48,289 thing. If you can't perceive a thing, 99 00:03:48,290 --> 00:03:49,729 you can't interact with it. 100 00:03:50,750 --> 00:03:52,429 This map here is the planned city of 101 00:03:52,430 --> 00:03:53,839 Brasilia, which is the 102 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:57,259 city that was built to be legible 103 00:03:57,260 --> 00:03:59,539 to be understandable to the state. 104 00:03:59,540 --> 00:04:01,009 The notion that a state should, if 105 00:04:01,010 --> 00:04:02,869 nothing else, even if it can't understand 106 00:04:02,870 --> 00:04:04,939 all of the rest of its territory, all of 107 00:04:04,940 --> 00:04:06,979 its other cities, it should be able to 108 00:04:06,980 --> 00:04:09,079 understand the city from 109 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:10,080 which it governs. 110 00:04:11,750 --> 00:04:13,909 Of course, I don't know how many 111 00:04:13,910 --> 00:04:15,349 of you are familiar with the actual city 112 00:04:15,350 --> 00:04:17,479 of Brasilia, but it doesn't look 113 00:04:17,480 --> 00:04:19,759 much like what's indicated on that map. 114 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:21,949 Reality has kind of come back in 115 00:04:21,950 --> 00:04:23,809 and gotten a lot messier again. 116 00:04:25,460 --> 00:04:26,959 So a lot of the time, 117 00:04:27,980 --> 00:04:30,319 the ability of a state to see 118 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:32,329 its citizens and to see its terrain is 119 00:04:32,330 --> 00:04:34,339 actually a very, very good thing. 120 00:04:34,340 --> 00:04:36,709 This is the snow map which founded modern 121 00:04:36,710 --> 00:04:37,609 epidemiology. 122 00:04:37,610 --> 00:04:40,189 It's a map of cholera deaths in London 123 00:04:40,190 --> 00:04:42,589 around a particular well when 124 00:04:42,590 --> 00:04:45,169 they didn't understand that 125 00:04:45,170 --> 00:04:47,269 water and the cholera was spread through 126 00:04:47,270 --> 00:04:48,270 water. 127 00:04:49,850 --> 00:04:51,919 This map told 128 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:53,869 us things about human disease 129 00:04:53,870 --> 00:04:57,049 transmission that have saved 130 00:04:57,050 --> 00:04:59,929 at least tens of millions of lives. 131 00:04:59,930 --> 00:05:01,849 And this is a form of surveillance. 132 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:06,149 Sometimes this is a bad thing. 133 00:05:06,150 --> 00:05:08,009 This is a map that the city of Amsterdam 134 00:05:08,010 --> 00:05:09,959 prepared from their very complete census 135 00:05:09,960 --> 00:05:12,029 records of where all the Jews were 136 00:05:12,030 --> 00:05:13,889 in Amsterdam for the Nazis. 137 00:05:18,090 --> 00:05:20,639 During the process 138 00:05:20,640 --> 00:05:23,009 of kind of the societal adjustments 139 00:05:23,010 --> 00:05:25,589 following the revolution in France, 140 00:05:25,590 --> 00:05:27,059 and this was actually one of the demands 141 00:05:27,060 --> 00:05:28,859 leading up to the revolution from certain 142 00:05:28,860 --> 00:05:29,970 sectors of society, 143 00:05:31,530 --> 00:05:33,839 the revolutionary 144 00:05:33,840 --> 00:05:35,789 government was continued under Napoleon, 145 00:05:35,790 --> 00:05:37,380 standardized on the metric system. 146 00:05:39,030 --> 00:05:41,249 One of the things that this did was 147 00:05:41,250 --> 00:05:43,409 that it eased a lot of the burdens on 148 00:05:43,410 --> 00:05:45,779 farmers who were having to deal with 149 00:05:45,780 --> 00:05:48,179 incompatible local unit systems 150 00:05:48,180 --> 00:05:50,399 being used to basically rip them off from 151 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:51,479 what they should have earned on their 152 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:52,379 profits. 153 00:05:52,380 --> 00:05:54,689 But it also laid 154 00:05:54,690 --> 00:05:57,389 the groundwork for tech standardization 155 00:05:57,390 --> 00:05:59,909 and for central control. 156 00:05:59,910 --> 00:06:02,009 To paraphrase Chateaubriand, what 157 00:06:02,010 --> 00:06:04,079 he said at the time, you know, 158 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:06,029 if someone's using the metric system that 159 00:06:06,030 --> 00:06:07,030 they're narc. 160 00:06:07,740 --> 00:06:09,239 In other words, you know that if someone 161 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:10,709 is using the metric system, they work for 162 00:06:10,710 --> 00:06:12,029 the government, they work for the order 163 00:06:12,030 --> 00:06:14,369 that is attempting to impose legibility 164 00:06:14,370 --> 00:06:15,370 on society 165 00:06:17,580 --> 00:06:19,379 in the state of Quinn in the fourth 166 00:06:19,380 --> 00:06:22,299 century B.C., no relation 167 00:06:22,300 --> 00:06:24,449 the the emperor 168 00:06:24,450 --> 00:06:26,879 decided that imposing 169 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:28,829 surnames on the population was a good 170 00:06:28,830 --> 00:06:29,830 idea. 171 00:06:30,420 --> 00:06:32,399 They needed to be able to 172 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:36,329 conscript people for labor and 173 00:06:36,330 --> 00:06:37,829 for the military. They needed to be able 174 00:06:37,830 --> 00:06:39,869 to tax people, and they needed to be able 175 00:06:39,870 --> 00:06:41,879 to apply laws to families. 176 00:06:43,020 --> 00:06:44,879 Now many of the ruling families and this 177 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:47,219 is true throughout the world in places 178 00:06:47,220 --> 00:06:49,469 where names have been, have been 179 00:06:49,470 --> 00:06:51,209 put into force and have been imposed on 180 00:06:51,210 --> 00:06:52,919 people. Many of the ruling families 181 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:54,509 already had surnames that were frequently 182 00:06:54,510 --> 00:06:56,639 attached to where they lived or where 183 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:57,809 they ruled. 184 00:06:57,810 --> 00:06:59,159 But common people had all sorts of 185 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:00,809 different ways of being known. 186 00:07:00,810 --> 00:07:02,999 And if you imagine that you've got 187 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:04,409 a dozen different ways that you can be 188 00:07:04,410 --> 00:07:06,569 named and you might have some 189 00:07:06,570 --> 00:07:09,359 reasons to not want to be 190 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:11,009 legible to the state. 191 00:07:11,010 --> 00:07:13,589 This is very, very convenient for you. 192 00:07:13,590 --> 00:07:15,869 So assigning patronages was a way 193 00:07:15,870 --> 00:07:18,509 of changing that power structure. 194 00:07:18,510 --> 00:07:19,739 And along the way, it may have also 195 00:07:19,740 --> 00:07:21,269 changed some of the power structures in 196 00:07:21,270 --> 00:07:23,399 the family. It's not clear. 197 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:25,529 But one of the things that they 198 00:07:25,530 --> 00:07:29,039 attempted to do was to make the 199 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:31,109 rest of, to make the head of a family 200 00:07:31,110 --> 00:07:32,999 responsible for all the actions of the 201 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:34,859 rest of the family, which you could 202 00:07:34,860 --> 00:07:36,720 reasonably see might have some, 203 00:07:38,370 --> 00:07:40,289 some cultural shifts. 204 00:07:40,290 --> 00:07:42,479 Now this is really interesting because 205 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:44,069 it shows that the vision of the state has 206 00:07:44,070 --> 00:07:46,229 consequences when the state looks 207 00:07:46,230 --> 00:07:47,429 at the world. 208 00:07:47,430 --> 00:07:49,889 It makes things fall into the boxes 209 00:07:49,890 --> 00:07:51,149 that it's measuring. 210 00:07:51,150 --> 00:07:52,589 Even if they didn't before. 211 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:55,349 In other words, networks weird 212 00:07:55,350 --> 00:07:56,350 legibility. 213 00:07:58,150 --> 00:07:59,150 So 214 00:08:00,670 --> 00:08:02,169 this is, I think, kind of a controversial 215 00:08:02,170 --> 00:08:03,879 statement in this room right now, but I 216 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,099 think that surveillance is 217 00:08:06,100 --> 00:08:08,589 actually a form of human concern, 218 00:08:08,590 --> 00:08:11,049 human attention and human concern 219 00:08:11,050 --> 00:08:13,179 and and surveillance 220 00:08:13,180 --> 00:08:14,889 is what we do when we care about 221 00:08:14,890 --> 00:08:17,499 something and sometimes 222 00:08:17,500 --> 00:08:20,439 that care takes positive forms. 223 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:22,659 Coming back to the color map, 224 00:08:22,660 --> 00:08:24,789 sometimes it allows us to 225 00:08:24,790 --> 00:08:26,889 build infrastructure that works for 226 00:08:26,890 --> 00:08:29,019 a lot of people. Sometimes it allows us 227 00:08:29,020 --> 00:08:31,479 to prevent disease and feed children 228 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:32,499 and so on and so forth. 229 00:08:32,500 --> 00:08:34,329 And sometimes it's used for political 230 00:08:34,330 --> 00:08:36,579 control, but it's always used in some 231 00:08:36,580 --> 00:08:38,859 way of concern. 232 00:08:38,860 --> 00:08:41,168 And like technology and 233 00:08:41,169 --> 00:08:42,969 many political qualities, it is neither 234 00:08:42,970 --> 00:08:43,928 good nor bad. 235 00:08:43,929 --> 00:08:45,220 Nor is it neutral, excuse me. 236 00:08:46,700 --> 00:08:48,849 And and I think that's 237 00:08:48,850 --> 00:08:50,649 one of the things we have to bear in mind 238 00:08:50,650 --> 00:08:53,499 in this particular age of surveillance 239 00:08:53,500 --> 00:08:55,749 is that in 240 00:08:55,750 --> 00:08:57,879 many ways, surveillance is the 241 00:08:57,880 --> 00:08:59,769 small touches that we do on each other. 242 00:08:59,770 --> 00:09:01,449 Surveillance is when we check up on each 243 00:09:01,450 --> 00:09:02,919 other and stuff like that. 244 00:09:02,920 --> 00:09:04,989 So finding a way to cast that to where we 245 00:09:04,990 --> 00:09:07,119 can reclaim the positive and suppress 246 00:09:07,120 --> 00:09:08,919 the negative is, I think, much more of 247 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:10,809 the task than to fight all surveillance. 248 00:09:10,810 --> 00:09:12,369 It's a much more subtle question than it 249 00:09:12,370 --> 00:09:13,370 would seem right now. 250 00:09:15,220 --> 00:09:16,569 But when we talk about this kind of 251 00:09:16,570 --> 00:09:18,739 vision of the state, the state is watcher 252 00:09:18,740 --> 00:09:20,949 of the state as as arbiter of money, 253 00:09:20,950 --> 00:09:23,079 for instance, the news 254 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:25,029 cycle we have right now, if we want to 255 00:09:25,030 --> 00:09:27,159 take it back all the way to 256 00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:29,499 fourth century B.C., China, 257 00:09:29,500 --> 00:09:32,529 this isn't this all makes more sense. 258 00:09:32,530 --> 00:09:34,329 You know, it makes sense that that 259 00:09:34,330 --> 00:09:35,739 nations are trying to get all the 260 00:09:35,740 --> 00:09:37,539 information they can because they're 261 00:09:37,540 --> 00:09:39,729 trying again to make their 262 00:09:39,730 --> 00:09:41,619 world legible. 263 00:09:41,620 --> 00:09:43,419 And when they get all that information, 264 00:09:43,420 --> 00:09:44,949 they're putting it into the categories 265 00:09:44,950 --> 00:09:47,440 that they perceive are meaningful. 266 00:09:48,790 --> 00:09:51,459 And and that means destroying 267 00:09:51,460 --> 00:09:53,559 by ignoring the ones that aren't. 268 00:09:53,560 --> 00:09:54,669 I think one of the things that's really 269 00:09:54,670 --> 00:09:56,229 useful about reading this history is it 270 00:09:56,230 --> 00:09:58,539 gives you a measure of prediction on 271 00:09:58,540 --> 00:10:00,129 what states are going to want to do with 272 00:10:00,130 --> 00:10:01,299 technology. 273 00:10:01,300 --> 00:10:02,979 They want to keep tabs on their people 274 00:10:02,980 --> 00:10:04,239 for good and bad reasons. 275 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:06,009 And there's always both good and bad 276 00:10:06,010 --> 00:10:08,559 reasons, and 277 00:10:08,560 --> 00:10:10,869 they want to take 278 00:10:10,870 --> 00:10:12,999 the power that they get 279 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:15,189 by being the state and use it to 280 00:10:15,190 --> 00:10:17,470 mold the country that they're in. 281 00:10:18,820 --> 00:10:21,429 That has been a tremendously 282 00:10:21,430 --> 00:10:23,239 progressive force in history and a 283 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:24,909 tremendously destructive one, but it 284 00:10:24,910 --> 00:10:27,519 still comes from the same fundamental 285 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:28,569 impulse. 286 00:10:28,570 --> 00:10:30,129 And this is why it's really easy for me 287 00:10:30,130 --> 00:10:32,199 to stand up and say a state will always 288 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:34,269 spy on its people as much as it possibly 289 00:10:34,270 --> 00:10:36,309 can, because states always have. 290 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:39,029 Not just to maintain their power, but 291 00:10:39,030 --> 00:10:41,279 just to maintain the 292 00:10:41,280 --> 00:10:43,349 ability to control consequences, 293 00:10:43,350 --> 00:10:44,759 which is a point that we'll return to 294 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:46,019 later. 295 00:10:46,020 --> 00:10:48,089 So we're in an odd 296 00:10:48,090 --> 00:10:49,739 time of history and I want to actually 297 00:10:49,740 --> 00:10:52,199 roll back to another 298 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:55,019 moment in history and introduce you 299 00:10:55,020 --> 00:10:57,209 to William Tyndale from the 300 00:10:57,210 --> 00:10:59,580 16th century and Tindale 301 00:11:00,810 --> 00:11:02,699 had to flee one day from his native 302 00:11:02,700 --> 00:11:04,889 England, and he never set foot in 303 00:11:04,890 --> 00:11:07,499 England again. He died outside of England 304 00:11:07,500 --> 00:11:10,079 because he decided to translate. 305 00:11:10,080 --> 00:11:11,219 He decided what he wanted to do was 306 00:11:11,220 --> 00:11:13,379 translate the Bible into English. 307 00:11:13,380 --> 00:11:15,539 Now, centuries before this, this 308 00:11:15,540 --> 00:11:17,129 was always a contentious issue, 309 00:11:17,130 --> 00:11:18,539 translating the Bible into the local 310 00:11:18,540 --> 00:11:20,069 language. 311 00:11:20,070 --> 00:11:21,149 It was generally in Latin 312 00:11:22,770 --> 00:11:24,629 centuries before this pope innocent. 313 00:11:24,630 --> 00:11:26,429 The third had had essentially 314 00:11:27,990 --> 00:11:30,029 sentenced to death people that would try 315 00:11:30,030 --> 00:11:32,159 to do something like this. 316 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:34,079 The lady was never even to touch the 317 00:11:34,080 --> 00:11:35,879 Bible. It was to be interpreted and 318 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:38,099 handed down from on high 319 00:11:38,100 --> 00:11:40,199 by the church because the 320 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:42,359 church were the people who had the 321 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:43,539 knowledge to understand it. 322 00:11:43,540 --> 00:11:46,049 It was a top down picture, and 323 00:11:46,050 --> 00:11:48,119 Tindale was part of a movement that 324 00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:49,859 wanted people to be able to take control 325 00:11:49,860 --> 00:11:52,289 of their own Christianity. 326 00:11:52,290 --> 00:11:54,779 He was opposed by Sir Thomas 327 00:11:54,780 --> 00:11:57,179 more. Now St. Thomas more, 328 00:11:57,180 --> 00:11:59,369 who believed that the church 329 00:11:59,370 --> 00:12:01,499 was necessary to keep order if this 330 00:12:01,500 --> 00:12:02,729 is sounding a bit Hobbesian. 331 00:12:02,730 --> 00:12:05,309 That's because it is a Hobbesian debate, 332 00:12:05,310 --> 00:12:07,289 and it is one that we are still kind of 333 00:12:07,290 --> 00:12:08,849 I'd say we're like in the third act of 334 00:12:08,850 --> 00:12:10,349 this. I used to think this was a good 335 00:12:10,350 --> 00:12:11,789 metaphor for where we are now, but 336 00:12:11,790 --> 00:12:13,109 actually, I think this is just the same 337 00:12:13,110 --> 00:12:14,579 thing going on. 338 00:12:14,580 --> 00:12:16,739 So more in Tindale got 339 00:12:16,740 --> 00:12:18,899 into a huge fight and 340 00:12:18,900 --> 00:12:20,039 more was on the run. 341 00:12:20,040 --> 00:12:21,449 Sorry, Tyndall was on the run. 342 00:12:21,450 --> 00:12:23,579 Morris was sitting when King Henry the 343 00:12:23,580 --> 00:12:26,009 eighth, and they got into 344 00:12:26,010 --> 00:12:27,839 a big argument. 345 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:30,059 And this argument spanned the continent 346 00:12:30,060 --> 00:12:32,699 at various points about whether or not 347 00:12:32,700 --> 00:12:34,529 the Bible should be in English and people 348 00:12:34,530 --> 00:12:35,849 should be able to interpret their own 349 00:12:35,850 --> 00:12:36,850 religion. 350 00:12:37,590 --> 00:12:39,599 And of course, that got started because 351 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:42,269 of this guy, Martin Luther, 352 00:12:42,270 --> 00:12:44,879 who created a bunch of 353 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:47,039 theses and stapled them to a door and 354 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:48,689 then and then sent them all around the 355 00:12:48,690 --> 00:12:50,219 continent. 356 00:12:50,220 --> 00:12:52,739 Again, nothing on this list 357 00:12:52,740 --> 00:12:54,929 of church reforms that Luther and Tindale 358 00:12:54,930 --> 00:12:56,699 and that whole crew wanted were new. 359 00:12:56,700 --> 00:12:58,439 Not a thing was new. 360 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:00,629 What was new was that if you were Martin 361 00:13:00,630 --> 00:13:01,979 Luther and you wanted to say the church 362 00:13:01,980 --> 00:13:04,079 needs to reform and you got on a horse 363 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:05,609 and to go tell people that that's what 364 00:13:05,610 --> 00:13:07,290 you believed the church would burn you. 365 00:13:09,270 --> 00:13:11,579 But something had changed. 366 00:13:11,580 --> 00:13:14,099 And this is also how Tindale 367 00:13:14,100 --> 00:13:16,229 and I mean this the 368 00:13:16,230 --> 00:13:18,359 statement Tindale ran away and then they 369 00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:20,429 had a fight for years doesn't 370 00:13:20,430 --> 00:13:22,679 make any sense to most people 371 00:13:22,680 --> 00:13:24,779 in that era. And it just sounds assumed 372 00:13:24,780 --> 00:13:27,119 to us because of communication technology 373 00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:28,439 and in this case, that communication 374 00:13:28,440 --> 00:13:30,539 technology is 375 00:13:30,540 --> 00:13:31,620 the printing press. 376 00:13:33,240 --> 00:13:34,240 So 377 00:13:35,790 --> 00:13:38,219 Luther was able to put out his 95 theses, 378 00:13:38,220 --> 00:13:40,319 sit safely with a patron 379 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:42,449 in Germany and say the church needed to 380 00:13:42,450 --> 00:13:44,249 reform. And the church did occasionally 381 00:13:44,250 --> 00:13:45,539 be like, Could you send them for a 382 00:13:45,540 --> 00:13:47,159 meeting? And he's like, No, I'll stay 383 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:49,529 here in Germany, it's fine. 384 00:13:49,530 --> 00:13:51,749 And and now, 385 00:13:51,750 --> 00:13:54,059 originally, though, the printing 386 00:13:54,060 --> 00:13:56,459 press had been a huge 387 00:13:56,460 --> 00:13:57,929 tool of the church. 388 00:13:57,930 --> 00:14:00,329 They were the biggest customers 389 00:14:00,330 --> 00:14:02,459 of printing not just 390 00:14:02,460 --> 00:14:04,919 to print Bibles, but to also standardize 391 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:06,389 the interpretation of the religion 392 00:14:06,390 --> 00:14:07,529 everywhere. They can print things out, 393 00:14:07,530 --> 00:14:10,109 send them out to all of Europe and 394 00:14:10,110 --> 00:14:12,719 gain control and again legibility 395 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:14,399 on their religion. Make sure that 396 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:17,189 everybody had the right materials. 397 00:14:17,190 --> 00:14:19,199 There was no corruption in them and 398 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:20,309 spread them everywhere. 399 00:14:20,310 --> 00:14:22,019 And that went on for a few years, and 400 00:14:22,020 --> 00:14:23,609 then the dissidents got a hold of this 401 00:14:23,610 --> 00:14:25,259 technology, and it turned out they could 402 00:14:25,260 --> 00:14:26,640 do the same thing the church could do. 403 00:14:27,780 --> 00:14:30,119 So the big question hanging over the 16th 404 00:14:30,120 --> 00:14:32,219 century was, was the printing 405 00:14:32,220 --> 00:14:34,139 press going to reform the Catholic 406 00:14:34,140 --> 00:14:35,140 Church? 407 00:14:36,540 --> 00:14:38,969 Well, in fact, the printing 408 00:14:38,970 --> 00:14:41,039 press reformed everything 409 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:43,109 on the planet and possibly 410 00:14:43,110 --> 00:14:44,220 a few things off the planet. 411 00:14:46,470 --> 00:14:48,809 So they didn't 412 00:14:48,810 --> 00:14:50,999 even have a language to ask the right 413 00:14:51,000 --> 00:14:53,699 question for the undertaking 414 00:14:53,700 --> 00:14:54,870 that they were embarking on. 415 00:14:58,900 --> 00:14:59,900 So 416 00:15:01,210 --> 00:15:03,489 Tindale and Moore were two threads inside 417 00:15:03,490 --> 00:15:05,499 one institutional power, but there are a 418 00:15:05,500 --> 00:15:07,629 lot of kinds of power in society, 419 00:15:07,630 --> 00:15:08,740 not just one. 420 00:15:10,510 --> 00:15:13,089 The church has waned in authority. 421 00:15:13,090 --> 00:15:14,979 Capitalism was in many ways just getting 422 00:15:14,980 --> 00:15:16,659 started. This was the birth of the East 423 00:15:16,660 --> 00:15:18,009 India Company. 424 00:15:18,010 --> 00:15:20,259 This was the birth of mercantilism 425 00:15:20,260 --> 00:15:21,260 in that same era. 426 00:15:22,450 --> 00:15:23,889 But the power of guns and the power of 427 00:15:23,890 --> 00:15:26,139 money and the power of God are just three 428 00:15:26,140 --> 00:15:28,149 different kinds of power, and they all 429 00:15:28,150 --> 00:15:30,069 let you do different kinds of things. 430 00:15:30,070 --> 00:15:32,259 They're not commence verbal with each 431 00:15:32,260 --> 00:15:34,329 other. They don't act on each other, they 432 00:15:34,330 --> 00:15:36,609 don't act on themselves. 433 00:15:36,610 --> 00:15:39,309 If you have a pile of money that doesn't 434 00:15:39,310 --> 00:15:41,829 necessarily let you directly 435 00:15:41,830 --> 00:15:43,869 influence what someone else who has a 436 00:15:43,870 --> 00:15:45,969 pile of money wants to do now, 437 00:15:45,970 --> 00:15:48,369 you can maybe take away their money 438 00:15:48,370 --> 00:15:50,709 or force them to do something 439 00:15:50,710 --> 00:15:52,089 else because you've bought the thing that 440 00:15:52,090 --> 00:15:53,590 they were trying to buy first. 441 00:15:56,020 --> 00:15:57,519 But there's a lot of subtlety here in 442 00:15:57,520 --> 00:15:59,619 terms of how power acts. 443 00:15:59,620 --> 00:16:01,510 And this is one of the things that 444 00:16:02,860 --> 00:16:05,109 seems to be occasionally getting 445 00:16:05,110 --> 00:16:07,269 missed while we talk about, oh, 446 00:16:07,270 --> 00:16:09,339 we need to force states to do such 447 00:16:09,340 --> 00:16:11,199 and such, we need to stop states from 448 00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:12,789 doing such and such. 449 00:16:12,790 --> 00:16:14,949 You know, there's this, you 450 00:16:14,950 --> 00:16:16,509 know, oh, corporate surveillance is the 451 00:16:16,510 --> 00:16:18,639 worst thing. Oh, state surveillance is 452 00:16:18,640 --> 00:16:19,689 the worst thing. No, they're different 453 00:16:19,690 --> 00:16:22,389 things, and they may be problematic 454 00:16:22,390 --> 00:16:24,129 in different ways. 455 00:16:24,130 --> 00:16:26,169 All power needs to be able to see the 456 00:16:26,170 --> 00:16:28,539 world enabled in order to act, 457 00:16:28,540 --> 00:16:30,999 whether you are a state or a corporation 458 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,309 or a church. You need your own kind 459 00:16:33,310 --> 00:16:35,439 of legibility and your own kind 460 00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:36,519 of surveillance. 461 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:38,709 Whether that means figuring out 462 00:16:38,710 --> 00:16:40,929 if the people in all of the villages are 463 00:16:40,930 --> 00:16:43,509 showing up in church on Sundays and 464 00:16:43,510 --> 00:16:45,249 whether or not they're doing any of these 465 00:16:45,250 --> 00:16:47,349 things that might be indicative of any of 466 00:16:47,350 --> 00:16:49,629 these various heresies that you keep 467 00:16:49,630 --> 00:16:50,619 hearing about. 468 00:16:50,620 --> 00:16:52,389 Well, let's go burn some people and find 469 00:16:52,390 --> 00:16:54,579 out. Or whether it just means 470 00:16:54,580 --> 00:16:56,649 that I need to be able to set cookies in 471 00:16:56,650 --> 00:16:58,719 your browser and figure out what kind of 472 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:00,039 porn you like. 473 00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:02,079 That's the same operation, but for very 474 00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:03,080 different reasons. 475 00:17:05,530 --> 00:17:07,809 States are panicking right 476 00:17:07,810 --> 00:17:10,029 now. They're acting the way they 477 00:17:10,030 --> 00:17:12,909 are because they're panicked. 478 00:17:12,910 --> 00:17:14,078 There's this thing that Quinn calls the 479 00:17:14,079 --> 00:17:15,669 consequence fairy. 480 00:17:15,670 --> 00:17:17,318 And it used to be that consequence. 481 00:17:17,319 --> 00:17:19,419 Ferry was a very staid creature, 482 00:17:19,420 --> 00:17:20,979 and it would sort of, you know, float 483 00:17:20,980 --> 00:17:23,078 slowly around the room and a light 484 00:17:23,079 --> 00:17:25,269 on the shoulders of heads of state and 485 00:17:25,270 --> 00:17:27,429 popes and bishops and, 486 00:17:27,430 --> 00:17:30,009 you know, capitalists and say your 487 00:17:30,010 --> 00:17:32,019 actions matter in the world, you're an 488 00:17:32,020 --> 00:17:33,999 important person. 489 00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:36,159 And at some point in the past 20 or so 490 00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:38,499 years, the consequence very got drunk. 491 00:17:38,500 --> 00:17:39,999 And now the consequence for is kind of 492 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:41,919 flitting around the room going, you 493 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:44,049 matter and you matter and 494 00:17:44,050 --> 00:17:45,339 you matter. 495 00:17:45,340 --> 00:17:46,839 And everybody else is like, What the 496 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:47,769 fuck? 497 00:17:47,770 --> 00:17:49,089 How do we even deal with this? 498 00:17:49,090 --> 00:17:50,919 Because we don't know how. 499 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:54,879 Because our legibility. 500 00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:56,919 You know, like the world hasn't changed. 501 00:17:56,920 --> 00:17:58,539 The stuff that we pull in is still the 502 00:17:58,540 --> 00:17:59,499 same thing. 503 00:17:59,500 --> 00:18:01,369 But it doesn't mean what it used to mean. 504 00:18:01,370 --> 00:18:03,369 We can't interpret it anymore. 505 00:18:03,370 --> 00:18:04,809 So one of the things we're seeing right 506 00:18:04,810 --> 00:18:07,149 now is we're seeing states 507 00:18:07,150 --> 00:18:09,159 desperately trying to hang on to not 508 00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:10,689 their ability to surveil, but their 509 00:18:10,690 --> 00:18:12,309 ability to understand. 510 00:18:12,310 --> 00:18:13,809 But those don't look different from the 511 00:18:13,810 --> 00:18:14,810 outside. 512 00:18:16,450 --> 00:18:18,669 Rule of law was never intended to 513 00:18:18,670 --> 00:18:20,619 operate in a state of exception, and this 514 00:18:20,620 --> 00:18:21,789 is one of the things which is very 515 00:18:21,790 --> 00:18:24,129 interesting if we talk about rule 516 00:18:24,130 --> 00:18:26,799 of law as a response to unrestricted 517 00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:28,539 surveillance or to any other of the 518 00:18:28,540 --> 00:18:29,799 problems in the world right now, 519 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:32,619 a state of exception and a state of rule 520 00:18:32,620 --> 00:18:34,719 of law are defined 521 00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:35,720 opposites. 522 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:38,949 We now live in a state of permanent, 523 00:18:38,950 --> 00:18:41,919 but neither pervasive nor complete 524 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:42,920 exception. 525 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:46,329 And this complicates all 526 00:18:46,330 --> 00:18:48,220 responses within systems. 527 00:18:51,180 --> 00:18:52,180 Sue? 528 00:18:53,250 --> 00:18:55,259 On a personal level, things have gotten 529 00:18:55,260 --> 00:18:56,260 weird to 530 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:01,229 positional ethics is 531 00:19:01,230 --> 00:19:03,299 basically what happens when you join 532 00:19:03,300 --> 00:19:04,779 an institution, when you join an 533 00:19:04,780 --> 00:19:07,169 organization, when you join a network, 534 00:19:07,170 --> 00:19:09,449 that network or that institution 535 00:19:09,450 --> 00:19:11,579 has a set of ethics that are attached 536 00:19:11,580 --> 00:19:12,479 to it. 537 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:14,669 And when you operate within that 538 00:19:14,670 --> 00:19:16,889 institution, you take on some 539 00:19:16,890 --> 00:19:19,049 of those ethics, you become 540 00:19:19,050 --> 00:19:21,449 the person that does the thing 541 00:19:21,450 --> 00:19:23,579 that the institution needs to 542 00:19:23,580 --> 00:19:24,580 do in the world. 543 00:19:26,190 --> 00:19:28,169 Now this is not complete. 544 00:19:28,170 --> 00:19:30,719 This is this is definitely not total 545 00:19:30,720 --> 00:19:32,099 infrastructure does this too. 546 00:19:32,100 --> 00:19:33,719 And this is a really interesting thing 547 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:35,309 for all of us to build communications 548 00:19:35,310 --> 00:19:36,689 infrastructure in the world. 549 00:19:36,690 --> 00:19:39,209 Infrastructure has an ethics now 550 00:19:39,210 --> 00:19:41,399 in a lot of cases right now that 551 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:43,679 ethics is actively suicidal. 552 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:45,149 We are dealing with suicidal 553 00:19:45,150 --> 00:19:47,669 infrastructure that we're embedded inside 554 00:19:47,670 --> 00:19:50,429 and we cannot become 555 00:19:50,430 --> 00:19:53,219 non suicidal ourselves entirely 556 00:19:53,220 --> 00:19:55,349 because we're still tied into that 557 00:19:55,350 --> 00:19:56,489 infrastructure. 558 00:19:56,490 --> 00:19:59,159 We can only become 559 00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:01,499 in some ways, sensible or human 560 00:20:01,500 --> 00:20:02,789 or humane again. 561 00:20:02,790 --> 00:20:04,499 If we get outside of that infrastructure, 562 00:20:04,500 --> 00:20:05,939 but we can't, because that's what runs 563 00:20:05,940 --> 00:20:06,940 society. 564 00:20:08,190 --> 00:20:09,869 Things in our lives can sometimes 565 00:20:09,870 --> 00:20:12,389 override positional ethics. 566 00:20:12,390 --> 00:20:14,189 And this is where our friend Walter 567 00:20:14,190 --> 00:20:15,509 really comes in, right? 568 00:20:15,510 --> 00:20:18,509 You know, if you have kids, 569 00:20:18,510 --> 00:20:20,789 all of a sudden you realize, Oh, 570 00:20:20,790 --> 00:20:23,009 I will do anything to feed these 571 00:20:23,010 --> 00:20:23,999 kids. 572 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:25,829 It doesn't matter what I thought my world 573 00:20:25,830 --> 00:20:27,419 used to be. 574 00:20:27,420 --> 00:20:28,559 My world is now different. 575 00:20:30,630 --> 00:20:32,369 And one of the things that's really 576 00:20:32,370 --> 00:20:34,169 interesting about life in a network 577 00:20:34,170 --> 00:20:36,659 society is that we don't just have 578 00:20:36,660 --> 00:20:37,769 a single set of ethics. 579 00:20:37,770 --> 00:20:39,299 We don't just have a single context 580 00:20:39,300 --> 00:20:40,649 anymore. 581 00:20:40,650 --> 00:20:42,419 We may find that we wake up in the 582 00:20:42,420 --> 00:20:44,579 morning and we go to work and we 583 00:20:44,580 --> 00:20:46,799 work on systems of state or corporate 584 00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:48,179 control all day. 585 00:20:48,180 --> 00:20:50,399 And then we go home and we do 586 00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:52,559 other work to undermine the exact 587 00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:55,049 same systems of control 588 00:20:55,050 --> 00:20:56,969 that we were working to build all day and 589 00:20:56,970 --> 00:20:59,249 we are literally fighting ourselves. 590 00:21:00,870 --> 00:21:03,119 That is one of the conditions of the next 591 00:21:03,120 --> 00:21:04,120 century. 592 00:21:10,260 --> 00:21:12,779 So one of the reasons that 593 00:21:12,780 --> 00:21:14,579 institutions are freaking out right now 594 00:21:14,580 --> 00:21:17,099 is because this network that we're on 595 00:21:17,100 --> 00:21:19,379 makes people weird, and actually, I like 596 00:21:19,380 --> 00:21:22,139 this particular network's weird people 597 00:21:22,140 --> 00:21:24,509 in almost like the high medieval sense 598 00:21:24,510 --> 00:21:26,669 they almost make people have a fake 599 00:21:26,670 --> 00:21:27,959 magic to them. 600 00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:29,759 And all of a sudden, one person can 601 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:31,919 become many people on the network, and 602 00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:34,169 that legibility that several 603 00:21:34,170 --> 00:21:36,449 thousand years of getting a last name 604 00:21:36,450 --> 00:21:38,729 on you people is suddenly gone because 605 00:21:38,730 --> 00:21:41,129 you've just invented 15 new people 606 00:21:41,130 --> 00:21:43,499 today and 607 00:21:43,500 --> 00:21:45,119 10000 if you wrote a script to do it. 608 00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:48,499 And all of a sudden, you know, 609 00:21:48,500 --> 00:21:50,609 the thing that that 610 00:21:50,610 --> 00:21:53,099 power has a grip on has weirded 611 00:21:53,100 --> 00:21:54,009 in that classic. 612 00:21:54,010 --> 00:21:55,919 It's totally full of a fake and 613 00:21:55,920 --> 00:21:57,749 uncontrollable magic, and that's what you 614 00:21:57,750 --> 00:21:58,859 are right now. 615 00:21:58,860 --> 00:22:00,059 That's what you are becoming. 616 00:22:00,060 --> 00:22:01,289 That's what people on the network have 617 00:22:01,290 --> 00:22:03,809 become and 618 00:22:03,810 --> 00:22:05,699 and the network has its own logic. 619 00:22:05,700 --> 00:22:07,049 Or possibly this. 620 00:22:07,050 --> 00:22:08,519 I'm not sure I want to apply that word 621 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:10,799 here, but but 622 00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:13,529 it's really true that the network rejects 623 00:22:13,530 --> 00:22:15,599 your reality and substitutes their own 624 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:17,519 those categories, those safe and 625 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:18,689 understandable and predictable 626 00:22:18,690 --> 00:22:21,179 categories. Those get weirded out too, 627 00:22:21,180 --> 00:22:22,619 and we're all kind of living through this 628 00:22:22,620 --> 00:22:24,359 process. This is all still within our 629 00:22:24,360 --> 00:22:25,469 lifetime. 630 00:22:25,470 --> 00:22:27,539 And and we don't have 631 00:22:27,540 --> 00:22:30,029 a social structure or even a language 632 00:22:30,030 --> 00:22:31,589 to describe the networks that we're 633 00:22:31,590 --> 00:22:32,590 living in right now. 634 00:22:34,860 --> 00:22:37,079 And it's 635 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:39,419 doing really, really strange 636 00:22:39,420 --> 00:22:41,399 things to institutions. 637 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,619 The internet, in particular, 638 00:22:43,620 --> 00:22:46,259 turns conduits into barriers. 639 00:22:46,260 --> 00:22:48,329 And I do mean that the IRA used 640 00:22:48,330 --> 00:22:49,679 to be the good guys. 641 00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:51,899 Their job from the 1950s was to 642 00:22:51,900 --> 00:22:54,719 standardize all the record players 643 00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:56,459 to make sure that all the record players 644 00:22:56,460 --> 00:22:58,739 would play all the records so 645 00:22:58,740 --> 00:23:00,339 that anyone could get music and to set up 646 00:23:00,340 --> 00:23:02,399 distribution system so that anyone 647 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:04,259 around the country could get anyone 648 00:23:04,260 --> 00:23:05,339 else's music. 649 00:23:05,340 --> 00:23:06,779 And this was actually a really 650 00:23:06,780 --> 00:23:08,519 interesting and magical thing they did, 651 00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:10,109 because if you were living, you know, in 652 00:23:10,110 --> 00:23:12,839 a Louisiana bayou in 1950, 653 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:15,239 you didn't hear music from New York 654 00:23:15,240 --> 00:23:17,999 until they fixed this system 655 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:19,859 and they allowed this this. 656 00:23:19,860 --> 00:23:20,999 They were one of the entities that 657 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:23,069 allowed this common culture to grow up 658 00:23:23,070 --> 00:23:25,139 in these other options to enter people's 659 00:23:25,140 --> 00:23:27,359 lives all over America. 660 00:23:27,360 --> 00:23:29,489 And they didn't actually really change 661 00:23:29,490 --> 00:23:31,889 what they did for the next 50 years. 662 00:23:33,060 --> 00:23:34,859 But the world did that pivot. 663 00:23:34,860 --> 00:23:36,569 The same one that put you at the heart of 664 00:23:36,570 --> 00:23:39,119 the matter took this conduit 665 00:23:39,120 --> 00:23:41,009 of information and turned it into a 666 00:23:41,010 --> 00:23:42,010 barrier. 667 00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:44,429 And the people who were working these 668 00:23:44,430 --> 00:23:46,589 jobs, the people who lived through this 669 00:23:46,590 --> 00:23:48,389 whole cycle with the RIAA. 670 00:23:48,390 --> 00:23:49,889 I got to say, like, as a journalist, you 671 00:23:49,890 --> 00:23:50,909 have to call them for interviews. 672 00:23:50,910 --> 00:23:52,679 It's like calling crazy people. 673 00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:54,389 And I have a lot of sympathy for them 674 00:23:54,390 --> 00:23:55,799 these days because they didn't do 675 00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:57,269 anything wrong. 676 00:23:57,270 --> 00:23:59,699 The whole world just went cuckoo 677 00:23:59,700 --> 00:24:00,700 from their perspective. 678 00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:05,179 And they're grabbing at reality as 679 00:24:05,180 --> 00:24:06,180 best they can. 680 00:24:07,370 --> 00:24:09,679 In fact, so many of the things 681 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:11,059 that would have been the awesome, geeky 682 00:24:11,060 --> 00:24:13,339 things to do in the 50s and 60s 683 00:24:13,340 --> 00:24:16,039 have turned from conduits 684 00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:19,069 and generous ways of sharing information 685 00:24:19,070 --> 00:24:20,959 into the barriers, trying to stop the 686 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,119 networks from doing their job better 687 00:24:23,120 --> 00:24:25,009 because they've got those kids to feed. 688 00:24:25,010 --> 00:24:26,539 And they've got a mortgage and what they 689 00:24:26,540 --> 00:24:27,679 were doing the right thing all their 690 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:29,469 lives. Why did they have to change now? 691 00:24:32,890 --> 00:24:33,890 So 692 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:37,479 what does it look like on a grand scale 693 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:39,579 when these these 694 00:24:39,580 --> 00:24:41,259 weird things go on with institutions and 695 00:24:41,260 --> 00:24:43,119 people? Well, some of you be familiar 696 00:24:43,120 --> 00:24:44,739 with this kind of graph. 697 00:24:44,740 --> 00:24:47,769 This is from 1979 to the present 698 00:24:47,770 --> 00:24:49,329 level of global protests. 699 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:51,879 And you're part of this, I think we all 700 00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:53,409 know is fed by the fact that coordinating 701 00:24:53,410 --> 00:24:55,599 protests is now piss easy compared 702 00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:57,730 to what it was prior to this, 703 00:25:00,100 --> 00:25:02,439 that it's, you know, it's like signing 704 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:04,749 up for a mass tweeting 705 00:25:04,750 --> 00:25:05,889 and then going somewhere. 706 00:25:05,890 --> 00:25:07,959 And it's something people can do in a 707 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:10,389 few minutes. It's something, you know, 708 00:25:10,390 --> 00:25:12,609 I the people who set up the 709 00:25:12,610 --> 00:25:15,159 act of protests in Poland 710 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:17,829 that brought down that legislation 711 00:25:17,830 --> 00:25:19,899 eventually. Weren't people who had been 712 00:25:19,900 --> 00:25:21,879 working on it for years and building 713 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:24,279 networks and and doing trainings 714 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:25,309 and so on and so forth. 715 00:25:25,310 --> 00:25:26,589 They're just like, I'm going to start a 716 00:25:26,590 --> 00:25:27,590 Facebook group. 717 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:30,309 And pretty soon there was 200000 people 718 00:25:30,310 --> 00:25:32,439 in 300 cities crashing a piece of 719 00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:34,869 legislation that was a treaty 720 00:25:34,870 --> 00:25:36,939 that was never even supposed to face 721 00:25:36,940 --> 00:25:39,129 any serious opposition that came 722 00:25:39,130 --> 00:25:40,209 out of nowhere. 723 00:25:40,210 --> 00:25:41,829 And that's one of the one with a Polish 724 00:25:41,830 --> 00:25:43,929 parliament massed up talk about weirding 725 00:25:43,930 --> 00:25:45,849 identity and institutions right there. 726 00:25:47,590 --> 00:25:49,329 This one's a little bit more subtle, but 727 00:25:49,330 --> 00:25:50,469 actually, I think ultimately more 728 00:25:50,470 --> 00:25:52,809 important something has happened since 729 00:25:52,810 --> 00:25:54,639 the 90s certainly took off by the year 730 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:55,599 2000. 731 00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:57,639 And actually, interestingly, maps pretty 732 00:25:57,640 --> 00:25:59,709 well with that global protest graph 733 00:25:59,710 --> 00:26:01,809 in a by pretty well I mean, in a rough 734 00:26:01,810 --> 00:26:03,279 sense that it has risen on a similar 735 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:05,469 plane, which is that this 736 00:26:05,470 --> 00:26:07,599 bottom line is is foreign 737 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:09,939 aid from 1970 738 00:26:09,940 --> 00:26:10,929 to the present. 739 00:26:10,930 --> 00:26:13,509 And that top line is international 740 00:26:13,510 --> 00:26:16,089 remittance and international remittances, 741 00:26:16,090 --> 00:26:18,159 the fancy pants term for sending money 742 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:19,160 home to your family. 743 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:22,539 So what's happened here is that 744 00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:26,529 the is that nearly three times 745 00:26:26,530 --> 00:26:28,719 as much money is sent by 746 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:31,239 immigrants back to their families, 747 00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:33,429 as is is sent to 748 00:26:33,430 --> 00:26:35,169 countries via foreign aid from 749 00:26:35,170 --> 00:26:37,179 governments and possibly other 750 00:26:37,180 --> 00:26:38,380 fundraising institutions. 751 00:26:39,790 --> 00:26:40,899 Why is that important? 752 00:26:40,900 --> 00:26:43,269 Because that's a system of mutual care. 753 00:26:43,270 --> 00:26:45,369 It is again largely 754 00:26:45,370 --> 00:26:46,909 illegible or stepping out of the state. 755 00:26:46,910 --> 00:26:48,819 Some of this actually the number is 756 00:26:48,820 --> 00:26:50,499 probably higher than this because it is 757 00:26:50,500 --> 00:26:52,779 very, very hard to count remittances 758 00:26:52,780 --> 00:26:54,939 that go through informal economies. 759 00:26:54,940 --> 00:26:56,379 A limitation that the people who studied 760 00:26:56,380 --> 00:26:58,719 this recognize, but by their very nature, 761 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:00,969 they are eligible and they're often 762 00:27:00,970 --> 00:27:02,649 used for remittance by people who are 763 00:27:02,650 --> 00:27:04,959 trying to avoid taxes or avoid 764 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:06,339 governments that are trying to skim off 765 00:27:06,340 --> 00:27:07,719 the top of the remittance economy. 766 00:27:09,010 --> 00:27:11,229 So again, the network is 767 00:27:11,230 --> 00:27:13,359 making things pretty weird. 768 00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:23,880 So 769 00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:28,669 I first got online in August of 1994, 770 00:27:28,670 --> 00:27:32,239 just before the internet suddenly 771 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:34,549 became a very different place 772 00:27:34,550 --> 00:27:36,349 for the first of probably the dozen or 773 00:27:36,350 --> 00:27:38,419 two dozen times that that's happened 774 00:27:38,420 --> 00:27:39,420 since then. 775 00:27:41,450 --> 00:27:42,450 And 776 00:27:43,820 --> 00:27:45,949 that culture that I first came in 777 00:27:45,950 --> 00:27:48,349 on was a culture 778 00:27:48,350 --> 00:27:49,849 where we were kind of off in a corner 779 00:27:49,850 --> 00:27:53,339 doing our own thing and. 780 00:27:53,340 --> 00:27:55,679 That September, when all the college 781 00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:57,929 kids came online and then everyone 782 00:27:57,930 --> 00:28:00,509 else started coming online, 783 00:28:00,510 --> 00:28:02,879 all of a sudden we don't live somewhere 784 00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:05,039 off in a corner. Now, all of a sudden 785 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:07,109 we live right in the middle of 786 00:28:07,110 --> 00:28:08,110 everything, 787 00:28:10,380 --> 00:28:12,959 and everything that we're doing is going 788 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:15,119 to keep echoing through 789 00:28:15,120 --> 00:28:17,489 history, no matter what we want to do. 790 00:28:19,140 --> 00:28:20,489 One of the things that means is that it 791 00:28:20,490 --> 00:28:22,219 means that we need to learn history. 792 00:28:22,220 --> 00:28:23,399 It means we need to learn our own 793 00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:24,989 history. 794 00:28:24,990 --> 00:28:27,119 If we continue 795 00:28:27,120 --> 00:28:29,609 to ignore 796 00:28:29,610 --> 00:28:31,259 the shaping effect that we have on the 797 00:28:31,260 --> 00:28:33,359 world, we miss 798 00:28:33,360 --> 00:28:34,259 a lot of things. 799 00:28:34,260 --> 00:28:35,579 It means we're going to keep repeating 800 00:28:35,580 --> 00:28:36,509 the same mistakes. 801 00:28:36,510 --> 00:28:38,249 It means we're not going to understand 802 00:28:38,250 --> 00:28:40,379 the victories that we won in the 803 00:28:40,380 --> 00:28:41,909 past. 804 00:28:41,910 --> 00:28:43,139 It means we're not going to understand 805 00:28:43,140 --> 00:28:45,209 the victories that other people won 806 00:28:45,210 --> 00:28:46,859 and see the similarities between the 807 00:28:46,860 --> 00:28:49,679 situations that we're in now 808 00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:51,869 and that some French peasant was in 700 809 00:28:51,870 --> 00:28:54,119 years ago or some Chinese peasant was 810 00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,339 in 2000 years ago. 811 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:01,499 That social change is really, 812 00:29:01,500 --> 00:29:02,500 really critical. 813 00:29:03,870 --> 00:29:06,179 You know, we keep hearing, Oh, 814 00:29:06,180 --> 00:29:08,639 codas, polished code is law laws 815 00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:10,679 code. There's this, there's this, you 816 00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:12,099 know, equivalent. 817 00:29:12,100 --> 00:29:14,339 See, now I think there's something deeper 818 00:29:14,340 --> 00:29:16,619 there as well. I think that 819 00:29:16,620 --> 00:29:18,869 code becomes given 820 00:29:18,870 --> 00:29:20,369 a hundred years culture. 821 00:29:21,990 --> 00:29:23,669 And that's a lot harder to predict. 822 00:29:23,670 --> 00:29:25,829 In some ways, we can look 823 00:29:25,830 --> 00:29:28,049 at a piece of law and 824 00:29:28,050 --> 00:29:30,269 make some guesses about 825 00:29:30,270 --> 00:29:31,619 what effect it's going to have on the 826 00:29:31,620 --> 00:29:33,839 world. It's a lot harder to make the same 827 00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:35,939 set of guesses about what a 828 00:29:35,940 --> 00:29:38,219 cultural object or a thing that will 829 00:29:38,220 --> 00:29:40,199 influence a cultural object is going to 830 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:41,279 have on the world. 831 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:42,869 But if we don't start thinking about it, 832 00:29:42,870 --> 00:29:44,759 we're definitely not going to get there. 833 00:29:45,870 --> 00:29:48,209 So one of the things 834 00:29:48,210 --> 00:29:50,339 that we're talking about is trying 835 00:29:50,340 --> 00:29:52,979 to stretch our minds, 836 00:29:52,980 --> 00:29:54,509 stretch out like our conceptions of 837 00:29:54,510 --> 00:29:56,579 history while living, while those 838 00:29:56,580 --> 00:29:58,229 institutions and those institutional 839 00:29:58,230 --> 00:30:00,029 ethics that we're talking about push you 840 00:30:00,030 --> 00:30:01,589 towards thinking in quarters. 841 00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:05,789 Most of culture is currently conducted 842 00:30:05,790 --> 00:30:08,129 on like quarters or maybe 843 00:30:08,130 --> 00:30:10,199 an annual cycle. 844 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:11,609 But somebody like pointed out to me 845 00:30:11,610 --> 00:30:14,339 recently that they can't right now find 846 00:30:14,340 --> 00:30:16,619 any articles that are making 847 00:30:16,620 --> 00:30:18,690 predictions for 2014. 848 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,979 Our time horizons have gotten so short 849 00:30:22,980 --> 00:30:25,259 that we are too scared to predict next 850 00:30:25,260 --> 00:30:26,260 month. 851 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:27,959 But we can look back. 852 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:29,879 We can look back at different points and 853 00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:30,959 and take lessons from them. 854 00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:32,279 Some of the things that we face right now 855 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,499 are unprecedented, as all history 856 00:30:34,500 --> 00:30:36,569 has been, and some of 857 00:30:36,570 --> 00:30:38,969 it is patterns that we can learn from. 858 00:30:38,970 --> 00:30:40,649 And when we step back and look at not 859 00:30:40,650 --> 00:30:43,049 just not just things like 860 00:30:43,050 --> 00:30:45,119 Tindale and more 861 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:47,129 and the path they traced up to the 862 00:30:47,130 --> 00:30:48,209 Enlightenment. 863 00:30:48,210 --> 00:30:51,119 And again, interestingly, it is almost 864 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:52,349 we can also look at things like the fall 865 00:30:52,350 --> 00:30:54,359 of the Roman Empire, the rise of paper 866 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:55,379 money in China. 867 00:30:55,380 --> 00:30:57,359 All these things are things that can help 868 00:30:57,360 --> 00:30:59,069 inform us and make us understand the 869 00:30:59,070 --> 00:31:01,169 technologies that we face today. 870 00:31:01,170 --> 00:31:03,329 But of course, there are limits because 871 00:31:03,330 --> 00:31:05,369 every moment is unprecedented. 872 00:31:05,370 --> 00:31:07,829 And right now, there are so many frickin 873 00:31:07,830 --> 00:31:09,119 people out there. 874 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:10,619 That's what's so strange about this 875 00:31:10,620 --> 00:31:11,819 moment every second. 876 00:31:11,820 --> 00:31:13,979 Two hundred and seventeen years of 877 00:31:13,980 --> 00:31:15,690 human experience pass on this planet. 878 00:31:17,700 --> 00:31:18,659 Since we've been talking. 879 00:31:18,660 --> 00:31:21,479 It's something close to 500000 880 00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:23,669 years in this in 881 00:31:23,670 --> 00:31:25,229 the course of this talk. 882 00:31:25,230 --> 00:31:27,119 That's the that's the human attention 883 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:29,519 that is passed from seven billion people. 884 00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:31,229 While we've been standing here, we've 885 00:31:31,230 --> 00:31:33,149 been standing. You've been sitting. 886 00:31:33,150 --> 00:31:35,399 And what I really want to start pushing 887 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,619 on you, pushing you towards 888 00:31:37,620 --> 00:31:40,289 is trying to look at that long time, 889 00:31:40,290 --> 00:31:42,809 try to look at what the world was like 890 00:31:42,810 --> 00:31:44,609 a few hundred years ago and try to 891 00:31:44,610 --> 00:31:46,439 imagine what you want the world to look 892 00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:47,880 like in 100 years, 893 00:31:49,020 --> 00:31:51,209 because that's a question very few of us 894 00:31:51,210 --> 00:31:52,619 can answer at this point. 895 00:31:52,620 --> 00:31:55,379 Not. What do you think it will look like? 896 00:31:55,380 --> 00:31:56,849 What do you want it to look like? 897 00:31:57,930 --> 00:32:00,059 What do you think is right for people 898 00:32:00,060 --> 00:32:01,469 in a hundred years? 899 00:32:01,470 --> 00:32:03,569 How do you hope people that you will 900 00:32:03,570 --> 00:32:04,589 never meet will live? 901 00:32:13,100 --> 00:32:14,629 People are different because of this 902 00:32:14,630 --> 00:32:16,729 network that we've built over the last 903 00:32:16,730 --> 00:32:17,730 30 years, 904 00:32:19,100 --> 00:32:20,899 but they're having to do it on brains 905 00:32:20,900 --> 00:32:22,519 that haven't had a chance to change. 906 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:26,209 Normally we have, we have decades and 907 00:32:26,210 --> 00:32:27,919 even generations to adjust to these kinds 908 00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:29,569 of change. Currently, we're living 909 00:32:29,570 --> 00:32:31,009 through an age where we have to adjust to 910 00:32:31,010 --> 00:32:33,169 these changes in 911 00:32:33,170 --> 00:32:34,819 a biologically challenging period of 912 00:32:34,820 --> 00:32:35,820 time. 913 00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:38,869 Billions of people, a number 914 00:32:38,870 --> 00:32:40,400 that none of us can conceive. 915 00:32:42,020 --> 00:32:43,279 Not just the ones on the network, but 916 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:44,749 those touched by the network, touched by 917 00:32:44,750 --> 00:32:46,879 the presence of the network 918 00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:49,159 are affected by what we 919 00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:50,420 as a community have built. 920 00:32:53,660 --> 00:32:55,729 Yes, we built a technology 921 00:32:55,730 --> 00:32:57,979 that lets governments monitor and control 922 00:32:57,980 --> 00:32:59,389 their people. We also built the 923 00:32:59,390 --> 00:33:01,099 technology that lets people escape the 924 00:33:01,100 --> 00:33:03,019 fates of their rulers and cultures hard 925 00:33:03,020 --> 00:33:05,089 for them. And sometimes we build 926 00:33:05,090 --> 00:33:07,220 those things in the same applications. 927 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,129 You have left millions 928 00:33:12,130 --> 00:33:14,049 and perhaps hundreds of millions of 929 00:33:14,050 --> 00:33:16,209 children know the mothers and fathers who 930 00:33:16,210 --> 00:33:17,949 had to leave them in order to feed them 931 00:33:17,950 --> 00:33:19,359 and care for them. 932 00:33:19,360 --> 00:33:20,889 A tradition that goes back many 933 00:33:20,890 --> 00:33:23,529 generations, many generations 934 00:33:23,530 --> 00:33:26,079 into social isolation and loss. 935 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:28,569 You've taken away the power of economics 936 00:33:28,570 --> 00:33:30,099 and distance to make strangers of 937 00:33:30,100 --> 00:33:31,100 families. 938 00:33:33,070 --> 00:33:35,319 This is what's buried in those dry 939 00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:36,369 remittance figures. 940 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:40,749 People, families, 941 00:33:42,130 --> 00:33:44,379 families of origin, families 942 00:33:44,380 --> 00:33:45,380 that we create 943 00:33:46,630 --> 00:33:49,089 distance no longer has the same power 944 00:33:49,090 --> 00:33:51,729 over its lives, over our lives 945 00:33:51,730 --> 00:33:53,409 because of the things that we all built 946 00:33:53,410 --> 00:33:54,519 in the last 30 years. 947 00:33:56,050 --> 00:33:57,999 This is what mutual care looks like. 948 00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:00,219 It looks like the faces of people. 949 00:34:00,220 --> 00:34:02,109 It looks like their blood and their 950 00:34:02,110 --> 00:34:03,429 flesh. 951 00:34:03,430 --> 00:34:05,949 And this is what our technology affects, 952 00:34:05,950 --> 00:34:07,390 controls and enables. 953 00:34:08,739 --> 00:34:10,959 You made millions of people care about 954 00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:12,428 people they didn't know existed. 955 00:34:13,690 --> 00:34:14,948 Millions of people they didn't know 956 00:34:14,949 --> 00:34:15,949 existed. 957 00:34:17,590 --> 00:34:19,899 You made not 958 00:34:19,900 --> 00:34:22,119 just distance, but 959 00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:24,638 the time, but the depth of time. 960 00:34:24,639 --> 00:34:27,009 The human record, all of recorded 961 00:34:27,010 --> 00:34:27,999 history. 962 00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:30,069 You made it so present that we can 963 00:34:30,070 --> 00:34:32,139 pluck it out of the air at any moment. 964 00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:35,469 That's what you did in the last 30 years. 965 00:34:36,730 --> 00:34:37,779 That's what you gave. 966 00:34:37,780 --> 00:34:39,669 Close to two billion people on this 967 00:34:39,670 --> 00:34:41,859 planet in the last 968 00:34:41,860 --> 00:34:42,860 30 years. 969 00:34:44,949 --> 00:34:46,269 That's what you're responsible for. 970 00:34:48,250 --> 00:34:50,769 I know that you didn't ask for this job 971 00:34:50,770 --> 00:34:52,238 and you didn't ask for this role in 972 00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:53,379 society. 973 00:34:53,380 --> 00:34:55,509 None of you. Not one of you wants 974 00:34:55,510 --> 00:34:57,789 to think about the many people 975 00:34:57,790 --> 00:34:59,859 that can be affected by one 976 00:34:59,860 --> 00:35:02,739 fucking perfectly normal bug or mistake 977 00:35:02,740 --> 00:35:04,659 in the technology that you built. 978 00:35:04,660 --> 00:35:06,069 And this is one of the reasons we keep 979 00:35:06,070 --> 00:35:07,599 our heads down. 980 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:09,429 No one became a geek because they wanted 981 00:35:09,430 --> 00:35:11,289 to be the center of political attention 982 00:35:13,420 --> 00:35:15,279 that just happened. 983 00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:16,869 You don't get to choose. 984 00:35:16,870 --> 00:35:18,219 You don't get to choose what era of 985 00:35:18,220 --> 00:35:20,019 history you live in and what that era 986 00:35:20,020 --> 00:35:21,020 wants to do with you. 987 00:35:22,330 --> 00:35:24,219 And this is a moment when it's all up for 988 00:35:24,220 --> 00:35:26,199 grabs. That's what it means to say we're 989 00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:27,759 on a burning planet. 990 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:29,169 And what it means to say that we don't 991 00:35:29,170 --> 00:35:30,729 have neutral ground is that you're at the 992 00:35:30,730 --> 00:35:32,379 center of that fire. 993 00:35:32,380 --> 00:35:33,819 You said it. 994 00:35:33,820 --> 00:35:35,079 You're one of the people that said it. 995 00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,239 You're one of the people that tended and 996 00:35:37,240 --> 00:35:38,919 everything you do. 997 00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:40,839 The changes you make over the next months 998 00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:42,429 and years are going to chime down decades 999 00:35:42,430 --> 00:35:43,689 and centuries and shape the lives of 1000 00:35:43,690 --> 00:35:46,119 people you will never know, but 1001 00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:47,199 they will know you. 1002 00:35:49,180 --> 00:35:50,469 For one thing, your lives are very well 1003 00:35:50,470 --> 00:35:51,470 recorded. 1004 00:35:55,820 --> 00:35:57,949 At this point, this is where 1005 00:35:57,950 --> 00:36:00,109 we are in history, but we're standing 1006 00:36:00,110 --> 00:36:01,759 at a conference where we still have to 1007 00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:03,589 remind people in the community to eat and 1008 00:36:03,590 --> 00:36:04,590 bathe themselves. 1009 00:36:13,380 --> 00:36:15,599 It is time for us to up our 1010 00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:16,600 game. 1011 00:36:22,140 --> 00:36:23,140 Thank you. 1012 00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:38,199 So I believe we will be taking questions 1013 00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:39,200 at the mics. 1014 00:36:42,430 --> 00:36:43,839 And possibly from the internet, I'm not 1015 00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:44,840 sure. 1016 00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:49,799 By the way, many of the citations that we 1017 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:51,479 use, not all, but many of the citations 1018 00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:53,369 that we used in the talk are contained 1019 00:36:53,370 --> 00:36:55,019 within these books and essays and so on 1020 00:36:55,020 --> 00:36:56,789 and so forth. And together they make a 1021 00:36:56,790 --> 00:36:58,799 pretty interesting follow on curriculum 1022 00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:00,599 as it were for the concepts we've been 1023 00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:01,600 talking about. 1024 00:37:20,670 --> 00:37:23,129 Hi, good evening. 1025 00:37:23,130 --> 00:37:25,109 Thank you for the presentation. 1026 00:37:25,110 --> 00:37:27,329 After the printing 1027 00:37:27,330 --> 00:37:29,489 technology came, we saw emancipate 1028 00:37:29,490 --> 00:37:31,829 emancipation of the human being, 1029 00:37:31,830 --> 00:37:34,769 human rights, end of slavery. 1030 00:37:34,770 --> 00:37:36,089 Do you think that could be something 1031 00:37:36,090 --> 00:37:38,189 similar happening with a new 1032 00:37:38,190 --> 00:37:40,439 man, which is in the Hansman and 1033 00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:42,869 also going through women's emancipation 1034 00:37:42,870 --> 00:37:45,299 and of digital slavery and 1035 00:37:45,300 --> 00:37:46,679 new human rights? 1036 00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:47,680 Can I take them? 1037 00:37:48,450 --> 00:37:50,610 So interestingly, we saw we saw 1038 00:37:51,720 --> 00:37:53,819 slavery as a explicit 1039 00:37:53,820 --> 00:37:55,859 condition abolished, but we saw it as an 1040 00:37:55,860 --> 00:37:57,869 implicit condition expanded. 1041 00:37:57,870 --> 00:38:00,539 So we have various people who end up 1042 00:38:00,540 --> 00:38:02,429 essentially living in slave like 1043 00:38:02,430 --> 00:38:04,619 conditions. They can't be they can't 1044 00:38:04,620 --> 00:38:05,729 be bought or sold well. 1045 00:38:05,730 --> 00:38:07,979 In some cases, they almost can be. 1046 00:38:07,980 --> 00:38:10,469 But it is. 1047 00:38:10,470 --> 00:38:12,329 It's interesting to watch how that 1048 00:38:12,330 --> 00:38:13,559 institution changed. And I think 1049 00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:14,699 actually, that's a really, really 1050 00:38:14,700 --> 00:38:16,889 important point because 1051 00:38:16,890 --> 00:38:19,169 this kind of modified human being 1052 00:38:19,170 --> 00:38:21,479 this we're all basically cyborgs 1053 00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:23,639 of some sort or another at this point, 1054 00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:25,049 living on a cyborg planet. 1055 00:38:25,050 --> 00:38:26,399 Like if you look at if you look at this 1056 00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:27,869 planet, this is not what the planet 1057 00:38:27,870 --> 00:38:28,779 naturally looks like. 1058 00:38:28,780 --> 00:38:29,910 This is what we have now. 1059 00:38:31,170 --> 00:38:33,359 And and I 1060 00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:35,519 think that the job of 1061 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:37,379 our generation, especially in the next 1062 00:38:37,380 --> 00:38:39,599 generation, is going to be to try 1063 00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:42,119 and end the slavery without instantiating 1064 00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:44,519 a new, subtler form of slavery 1065 00:38:44,520 --> 00:38:46,499 like we did last time. 1066 00:38:46,500 --> 00:38:48,809 So this is coming this 1067 00:38:48,810 --> 00:38:50,099 these enhancements are coming. 1068 00:38:50,100 --> 00:38:51,479 There's nothing we can do about it except 1069 00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:52,619 make it positive. 1070 00:38:52,620 --> 00:38:54,629 I see ways in which emergent structures 1071 00:38:54,630 --> 00:38:56,639 can make this world a much better place. 1072 00:38:56,640 --> 00:38:58,289 But I also see ways in which emergent 1073 00:38:58,290 --> 00:39:00,809 structures fighting state power 1074 00:39:00,810 --> 00:39:03,059 turning violent could make a completely 1075 00:39:03,060 --> 00:39:05,309 gray, featureless, terrible 1076 00:39:05,310 --> 00:39:07,499 planet where anyone who was different was 1077 00:39:07,500 --> 00:39:09,089 instantly destroyed. 1078 00:39:09,090 --> 00:39:10,589 I think that's what our network could do 1079 00:39:10,590 --> 00:39:11,939 in the worst case. 1080 00:39:11,940 --> 00:39:13,230 I'd rather it didn't do that. 1081 00:39:15,090 --> 00:39:16,709 OK, thank you. 1082 00:39:16,710 --> 00:39:18,179 Laurie Mark of order. 1083 00:39:18,180 --> 00:39:19,529 Basically, if you're standing in the 1084 00:39:19,530 --> 00:39:21,629 area, either go to ask a question, sit 1085 00:39:21,630 --> 00:39:23,699 down or leave no standing around 1086 00:39:23,700 --> 00:39:25,289 blocking entrances. Roger Ailes. 1087 00:39:25,290 --> 00:39:26,459 Thank you. 1088 00:39:26,460 --> 00:39:28,739 And the next question over there, 1089 00:39:28,740 --> 00:39:31,049 I not so much a question 1090 00:39:31,050 --> 00:39:33,149 as a comment I would like to 1091 00:39:33,150 --> 00:39:35,069 encourage, in addition to reading those 1092 00:39:35,070 --> 00:39:37,499 books that we need to learn 1093 00:39:37,500 --> 00:39:40,619 and remember more about our own history, 1094 00:39:40,620 --> 00:39:42,869 including our very recent history. 1095 00:39:42,870 --> 00:39:44,939 It disturbs me that there 1096 00:39:44,940 --> 00:39:47,579 have been there are books about 1097 00:39:47,580 --> 00:39:50,129 cryptographic algorithms, there are books 1098 00:39:50,130 --> 00:39:52,199 about early 1099 00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:54,569 days of hacking, but I talk to people 1100 00:39:54,570 --> 00:39:56,639 younger than myself or, you know, in 1101 00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:58,949 their teens and 20s, and 1102 00:39:58,950 --> 00:40:01,019 they're from the people I've 1103 00:40:01,020 --> 00:40:03,389 talked to. There is an astounding lack 1104 00:40:03,390 --> 00:40:05,129 of awareness of, say, like the first 1105 00:40:05,130 --> 00:40:06,899 crypto war. 1106 00:40:06,900 --> 00:40:08,999 Nobody that I know 1107 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,159 of who is significantly 1108 00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:13,409 younger than me knows about the Clipper 1109 00:40:13,410 --> 00:40:15,569 chip of Cortez or how we 1110 00:40:15,570 --> 00:40:16,570 got. 1111 00:40:17,850 --> 00:40:20,219 I want I want to open crypto with, 1112 00:40:20,220 --> 00:40:21,359 you know, the combination of the 1113 00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:23,729 expiration of patents 1114 00:40:23,730 --> 00:40:25,919 and some of the other free software 1115 00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:28,199 that developed the period of, 1116 00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:31,439 say, like 1988 to 1992 1117 00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:33,539 as a collected history seems 1118 00:40:33,540 --> 00:40:35,189 to be blank. 1119 00:40:35,190 --> 00:40:36,469 So let me actually build on. 1120 00:40:36,470 --> 00:40:38,279 I find that finally disturbing. 1121 00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:40,109 Everybody in the room who has some sort 1122 00:40:40,110 --> 00:40:41,519 of computer science degree or related 1123 00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:42,520 degree put up your hand. 1124 00:40:43,620 --> 00:40:46,229 Now everyone who 1125 00:40:46,230 --> 00:40:48,659 keep your hands up now, everyone 1126 00:40:48,660 --> 00:40:50,879 who read Claude Shannon 1127 00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:52,409 in school, put your hands down. 1128 00:40:54,330 --> 00:40:56,069 OK, so all of you are people with six 1129 00:40:56,070 --> 00:40:57,929 degrees who didn't read Claude Shannon, 1130 00:40:57,930 --> 00:41:00,839 one of the most fundamental voices 1131 00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:02,099 in everything you do. 1132 00:41:03,390 --> 00:41:04,949 And that's kind of goes to this 1133 00:41:04,950 --> 00:41:07,229 interesting point about 1134 00:41:07,230 --> 00:41:08,279 about understanding your history. 1135 00:41:08,280 --> 00:41:09,629 I think one of the great things you can 1136 00:41:09,630 --> 00:41:11,759 do is talk to old people, ask them what 1137 00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:14,039 life used to be like, and 1138 00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:16,349 I will talk your ear about this off 1139 00:41:16,350 --> 00:41:17,849 about this because let's make sure other 1140 00:41:17,850 --> 00:41:20,029 people can actually talk 1141 00:41:20,030 --> 00:41:21,030 so. 1142 00:41:23,740 --> 00:41:25,899 So you talked about the 1143 00:41:25,900 --> 00:41:28,239 view of the states, while the state 1144 00:41:28,240 --> 00:41:30,369 itself is just some sort of 1145 00:41:30,370 --> 00:41:32,619 technology to keep society 1146 00:41:32,620 --> 00:41:35,599 of humankind working. 1147 00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:38,079 So while 1148 00:41:38,080 --> 00:41:40,509 I really enjoyed your talk, I was 1149 00:41:40,510 --> 00:41:42,339 thinking whether you have thought about 1150 00:41:42,340 --> 00:41:44,469 the possibility 1151 00:41:44,470 --> 00:41:46,899 that some 1152 00:41:46,900 --> 00:41:49,089 sort of new technologies we are 1153 00:41:49,090 --> 00:41:51,309 inventing building may 1154 00:41:51,310 --> 00:41:53,619 even supersede state structure 1155 00:41:53,620 --> 00:41:54,620 and 1156 00:41:55,810 --> 00:41:58,539 do even more fundamental change 1157 00:41:58,540 --> 00:42:01,209 how humans interact on the global level. 1158 00:42:01,210 --> 00:42:04,329 So while we could 1159 00:42:04,330 --> 00:42:06,310 and may replace the state, 1160 00:42:09,820 --> 00:42:11,320 I really like roads. 1161 00:42:12,490 --> 00:42:14,559 One of the things that we often end 1162 00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:16,659 up doing, and especially in the gay 1163 00:42:16,660 --> 00:42:18,639 community, we will end up building 1164 00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:20,229 technologies, which will they sort of 1165 00:42:20,230 --> 00:42:21,230 mostly work 1166 00:42:22,780 --> 00:42:24,939 that doesn't cut it for water systems, 1167 00:42:24,940 --> 00:42:26,379 that doesn't cut it for a lot of the 1168 00:42:26,380 --> 00:42:27,879 stuff that keeps us alive. 1169 00:42:29,770 --> 00:42:32,049 I don't think it is unreasonable to start 1170 00:42:32,050 --> 00:42:33,699 the project of trying to replace the 1171 00:42:33,700 --> 00:42:36,459 state. I definitely don't. 1172 00:42:36,460 --> 00:42:38,109 But we need to make sure that we get it 1173 00:42:38,110 --> 00:42:40,209 right. Because if you fuck that one up 1174 00:42:40,210 --> 00:42:42,249 too badly, things get really, really 1175 00:42:42,250 --> 00:42:43,059 horrific. 1176 00:42:43,060 --> 00:42:44,079 I completely agree. 1177 00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:46,629 But I was just 1178 00:42:46,630 --> 00:42:48,789 I thought this talk was a bit focused 1179 00:42:48,790 --> 00:42:50,529 on the state. While the state for me is 1180 00:42:50,530 --> 00:42:53,259 just another technology and 1181 00:42:53,260 --> 00:42:55,419 the state is the technology that has kept 1182 00:42:55,420 --> 00:42:57,819 most humans alive for most 1183 00:42:57,820 --> 00:42:59,199 recorded history. 1184 00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:01,389 So it's reasonable to spend a certain 1185 00:43:01,390 --> 00:43:02,390 amount of time on it. 1186 00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:15,299 Jeff, thank you. 1187 00:43:15,300 --> 00:43:17,579 Thank you for a brilliant talk, 1188 00:43:17,580 --> 00:43:20,009 basically, for me, it boils down 1189 00:43:20,010 --> 00:43:23,039 to this. So instead of a question, people 1190 00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:24,089 don't be scared. 1191 00:43:24,090 --> 00:43:26,399 Be prepared. Be prepared. 1192 00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:27,449 Don't be predictable. 1193 00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:32,769 Okay, questions are short sentences 1194 00:43:32,770 --> 00:43:34,329 with a question mark, and could you 1195 00:43:34,330 --> 00:43:36,819 please write down some of 1196 00:43:36,820 --> 00:43:38,559 the people who are watching this team are 1197 00:43:38,560 --> 00:43:40,059 complaining about the older quality 1198 00:43:40,060 --> 00:43:41,679 because of the noise of people answering 1199 00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:42,639 and leaving? 1200 00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:45,069 So either come and take a seat, be quiet 1201 00:43:45,070 --> 00:43:46,829 or just leave. Thank you. 1202 00:43:46,830 --> 00:43:48,249 Oh, and the next question we have one 1203 00:43:48,250 --> 00:43:49,250 last question. 1204 00:43:50,290 --> 00:43:51,249 Oh, that. 1205 00:43:51,250 --> 00:43:53,529 Yes. Yeah. Actually, I am 1206 00:43:53,530 --> 00:43:55,599 afraid. I'm very, very afraid 1207 00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:57,759 because I feel like we're walking on 1208 00:43:57,760 --> 00:44:00,039 a very, very thin line because the 1209 00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:02,139 actions that we take could 1210 00:44:02,140 --> 00:44:04,539 easily tip whatever 1211 00:44:04,540 --> 00:44:06,789 will happen in what we do in the 1212 00:44:06,790 --> 00:44:08,859 favor of what we want or what we don't 1213 00:44:08,860 --> 00:44:10,779 want. And I feel like even when I look 1214 00:44:10,780 --> 00:44:12,849 backwards in history, 1215 00:44:12,850 --> 00:44:15,219 it's never been like this that that I 1216 00:44:15,220 --> 00:44:17,349 basically when I try to create something 1217 00:44:17,350 --> 00:44:19,959 I might later wake up in, like a 1218 00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,149 scene of a dystopian movie where all 1219 00:44:22,150 --> 00:44:24,369 I have created ends up destroying all 1220 00:44:24,370 --> 00:44:25,299 that I love. 1221 00:44:25,300 --> 00:44:28,299 So how can I not be afraid? 1222 00:44:28,300 --> 00:44:30,169 So I think that was always true. 1223 00:44:30,170 --> 00:44:32,139 Yes, but you were going to be dead before 1224 00:44:32,140 --> 00:44:33,140 it happened. 1225 00:44:34,330 --> 00:44:35,330 That's awesome. 1226 00:44:38,270 --> 00:44:39,919 I want to tell you 1227 00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:42,289 quickly about Fritz Haber. 1228 00:44:42,290 --> 00:44:44,419 Fritz, however, is a guy who 1229 00:44:44,420 --> 00:44:46,519 dedicated his life to inventing as 1230 00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:48,229 many horrific chemical weapons as he 1231 00:44:48,230 --> 00:44:49,309 could. 1232 00:44:49,310 --> 00:44:51,199 And along the way, he worked out nitrogen 1233 00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:53,299 fixing, which is 1234 00:44:53,300 --> 00:44:54,590 why we have all these people. 1235 00:44:56,750 --> 00:44:58,819 And and what's really interesting about 1236 00:44:58,820 --> 00:44:59,779 that to me? 1237 00:44:59,780 --> 00:45:01,369 Things like Fritz hovers many people. 1238 00:45:01,370 --> 00:45:03,199 I keep in mind when I think to some 1239 00:45:03,200 --> 00:45:04,669 degree, we have to let go of the fear 1240 00:45:04,670 --> 00:45:06,529 because we will never actually control 1241 00:45:06,530 --> 00:45:07,999 the good or ill we do in the world. 1242 00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:09,949 We can nudge, we can push, we can hope. 1243 00:45:09,950 --> 00:45:12,259 But at the end, if the most 1244 00:45:12,260 --> 00:45:14,719 amazing boon 1245 00:45:14,720 --> 00:45:17,089 to human life came from a guy 1246 00:45:17,090 --> 00:45:18,529 who was trying to invent chemical 1247 00:45:18,530 --> 00:45:20,989 weapons, we really 1248 00:45:20,990 --> 00:45:23,019 no one's driving this crazy train. 1249 00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:27,109 OK, thank you very much. 1250 00:45:28,250 --> 00:45:29,250 That was it.