0 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:30,000 Dear viewer, these subtitles were generated by a machine via the service Trint and therefore are (very) buggy. If you are capable, please help us to create good quality subtitles: https://c3subtitles.de/talk/754 Thanks! 1 00:00:14,310 --> 00:00:15,310 Apparently, 2 00:00:16,800 --> 00:00:19,109 our previous economist is 3 00:00:19,110 --> 00:00:21,809 the root evil after Terrytown, 4 00:00:21,810 --> 00:00:22,810 Puritani, and 5 00:00:24,270 --> 00:00:26,399 origins of 6 00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:29,679 whatever goes on the guns, masturbation. 7 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:30,680 So 8 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:34,559 we now have a researcher working 9 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:36,869 at Columbia University in 10 00:00:36,870 --> 00:00:39,479 political science to, 11 00:00:39,480 --> 00:00:40,799 well, tell us 12 00:00:42,660 --> 00:00:44,729 how Facebook, the social 13 00:00:44,730 --> 00:00:46,799 networks and all that nice 14 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:48,869 digital stuff that we build around 15 00:00:48,870 --> 00:00:51,479 us might be 16 00:00:51,480 --> 00:00:53,549 enforcing a new preliterate 17 00:00:53,550 --> 00:00:55,819 in law and time. 18 00:00:57,120 --> 00:00:58,120 So 19 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:02,220 not sure if that's going to be nice, 20 00:01:03,990 --> 00:01:04,229 but. 21 00:01:04,230 --> 00:01:06,419 Well, anyways, please give a warm round 22 00:01:06,420 --> 00:01:08,730 of applause to Charlene Biondi. 23 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:24,080 OK. 24 00:01:26,660 --> 00:01:28,219 It seems like there's a Puritan 25 00:01:28,220 --> 00:01:30,229 conspiracy in Silicon Valley. 26 00:01:30,230 --> 00:01:32,389 No, really, I mean, it really seems 27 00:01:32,390 --> 00:01:34,489 like the iCloud was actually 28 00:01:34,490 --> 00:01:36,829 invented to punish, to 29 00:01:36,830 --> 00:01:39,469 punish the unfaithful lovers 30 00:01:39,470 --> 00:01:41,839 like Apple figured out all the best 31 00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:44,419 way possible to catch 32 00:01:44,420 --> 00:01:46,999 the misbehaving husband and wives 33 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:48,200 and hang them in progress. 34 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:52,279 Or at least that's what my 35 00:01:52,280 --> 00:01:53,599 friend Matt thinks. 36 00:01:55,340 --> 00:01:57,619 Last Christmas last year, Matt, 37 00:01:57,620 --> 00:02:00,739 but an iPad for his seven year old son. 38 00:02:00,740 --> 00:02:03,499 And so he enters his password in iTunes 39 00:02:03,500 --> 00:02:05,599 so that the kid can download 40 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:07,369 the apps and all the games that he 41 00:02:07,370 --> 00:02:08,629 wanted. 42 00:02:08,630 --> 00:02:09,709 And the next morning, 43 00:02:10,970 --> 00:02:13,639 the kid walks into the living room 44 00:02:13,640 --> 00:02:15,319 where Matt and his wife are sitting 45 00:02:16,460 --> 00:02:17,629 holding the iPad 46 00:02:18,710 --> 00:02:21,409 and he goes, Daddy, 47 00:02:21,410 --> 00:02:22,730 who's Jessica? 48 00:02:24,170 --> 00:02:26,239 And before Matt could grab 49 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:28,219 the iPad, his wife did. 50 00:02:28,220 --> 00:02:30,319 And she read all the text messages 51 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:33,199 that Matt had been sending to Jessica 52 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:35,419 on his iPhone, but now 53 00:02:35,420 --> 00:02:37,819 popping up on the iPad, iCloud 54 00:02:37,820 --> 00:02:38,820 magic. 55 00:02:40,640 --> 00:02:42,679 And so, needless to say, that is not a 56 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:43,759 married man anymore. 57 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:48,529 And so this story made me delete my 58 00:02:48,530 --> 00:02:50,900 iCloud account, but. 59 00:02:57,540 --> 00:02:59,759 It also bothered me for 60 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:02,069 a very long time because 61 00:03:02,070 --> 00:03:04,469 it shed light on digital surveillance 62 00:03:04,470 --> 00:03:06,539 from a perspective that I had never even 63 00:03:06,540 --> 00:03:09,029 considered before a Puritan 64 00:03:09,030 --> 00:03:10,030 conspiracy. 65 00:03:11,130 --> 00:03:12,959 I mean, I knew that surveillance, 66 00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:15,239 especially digital surveillance, had 67 00:03:15,240 --> 00:03:17,339 normalizing effects on people, meaning it 68 00:03:17,340 --> 00:03:19,169 forced people into certain norms and 69 00:03:19,170 --> 00:03:20,170 conduct. 70 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:23,569 But could it be that it 71 00:03:23,570 --> 00:03:25,789 also had a moralizing 72 00:03:25,790 --> 00:03:26,989 effect on people? 73 00:03:26,990 --> 00:03:28,969 Could it be that the great actors of 74 00:03:28,970 --> 00:03:31,399 digital surveillance, Facebook, Google, 75 00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:33,739 the NSA, you name it, were 76 00:03:33,740 --> 00:03:35,839 exerting upon us a 77 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:36,919 power similar 78 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:40,279 to the power of Catholic priests? 79 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:43,639 The power of the guilt trip, a 80 00:03:43,640 --> 00:03:45,829 power that would force us into 81 00:03:45,830 --> 00:03:47,629 confessing our sins. 82 00:03:50,700 --> 00:03:53,639 So especially in this room, 83 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:54,750 I guess it would be. 84 00:03:56,410 --> 00:03:58,719 Really banal, if I reminded you 85 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:01,209 that digital surveillance invades 86 00:04:01,210 --> 00:04:03,279 your privacy and that 87 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:05,080 it also violates your intimacy. 88 00:04:06,910 --> 00:04:09,579 But what exactly 89 00:04:09,580 --> 00:04:11,919 is the most intimate activity 90 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:14,799 that a human being can do? 91 00:04:14,800 --> 00:04:16,449 A human being mean men, women and 92 00:04:16,450 --> 00:04:17,450 children included? 93 00:04:18,430 --> 00:04:21,249 When I asked this question yesterday 94 00:04:21,250 --> 00:04:22,659 to prepare for this dark, someone 95 00:04:22,660 --> 00:04:24,729 answered, Praying is 96 00:04:24,730 --> 00:04:26,649 the most intimate activity a human being 97 00:04:26,650 --> 00:04:28,029 can engage in, and that's very 98 00:04:28,030 --> 00:04:30,309 interesting. But it doesn't really work 99 00:04:30,310 --> 00:04:31,839 because if you're praying and I walk into 100 00:04:31,840 --> 00:04:33,309 the room, are you praying? 101 00:04:33,310 --> 00:04:35,559 I'm not really invading your 102 00:04:35,560 --> 00:04:38,289 intimacy. You can just keep praying. 103 00:04:38,290 --> 00:04:40,089 So I'd love to have you guess, but since 104 00:04:40,090 --> 00:04:41,949 my speech was introduced, you already 105 00:04:41,950 --> 00:04:43,719 know the answer. So I'm just going to say 106 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:45,099 it quickly. 107 00:04:45,100 --> 00:04:47,169 The most intimate activity that a human 108 00:04:47,170 --> 00:04:49,839 being can engage in is masturbation 109 00:04:51,070 --> 00:04:52,309 and masturbation. 110 00:04:52,310 --> 00:04:54,879 My friends has a history 111 00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:57,639 that actually tells us a lot 112 00:04:57,640 --> 00:04:58,640 about surveillance. 113 00:05:00,130 --> 00:05:02,319 And the point of my 114 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:05,619 talk today is going to be 115 00:05:05,620 --> 00:05:08,109 the digital surveillance has similar 116 00:05:08,110 --> 00:05:10,419 mechanisms and similar effects 117 00:05:10,420 --> 00:05:12,849 on us as a crusade 118 00:05:12,850 --> 00:05:14,309 against masturbation. 119 00:05:14,310 --> 00:05:16,659 This was launched in the 18th century 120 00:05:16,660 --> 00:05:17,660 in Europe. 121 00:05:18,970 --> 00:05:20,380 And first and above all. 122 00:05:22,580 --> 00:05:24,469 The first thing they have in common is 123 00:05:24,470 --> 00:05:26,239 that both the events of the 18th century, 124 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:27,559 surveillance of the masturbators and 125 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:30,049 digital surveillance are arbitrary 126 00:05:30,050 --> 00:05:31,050 and ineffective. 127 00:05:32,300 --> 00:05:34,429 So why was 128 00:05:34,430 --> 00:05:36,349 surveillance in the Asian century 129 00:05:36,350 --> 00:05:37,699 arbitrary? 130 00:05:37,700 --> 00:05:39,949 Because actually before the 18th century, 131 00:05:39,950 --> 00:05:42,109 nobody cared about masturbation, not 132 00:05:42,110 --> 00:05:44,239 even the Catholic priests. 133 00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:46,489 I mean, they 134 00:05:46,490 --> 00:05:48,319 barely said the Catholic priest said it 135 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:49,549 was something that should be avoided. 136 00:05:49,550 --> 00:05:51,439 It was a very minor concern and it only 137 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,719 concerned adult men and monks 138 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:55,939 until the beginning of 139 00:05:55,940 --> 00:05:58,129 the seventeen hundred and the publication 140 00:05:58,130 --> 00:06:00,439 of that tract, a medical tract 141 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:01,789 by a British doctor 142 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:05,509 that says Bonnano, 143 00:06:05,510 --> 00:06:07,669 the Heinsohn of self-delusion and 144 00:06:07,670 --> 00:06:10,039 its frightful consequences in both sexes 145 00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:12,379 considered and this tract 146 00:06:12,380 --> 00:06:14,629 started a crusade against masturbation 147 00:06:14,630 --> 00:06:16,189 in all of Europe. 148 00:06:16,190 --> 00:06:18,319 For the first time, a masturbation became 149 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:20,389 an abnormal thing to do that was 150 00:06:20,390 --> 00:06:21,949 dangerous not only for the individual, 151 00:06:21,950 --> 00:06:23,059 but for society. 152 00:06:23,060 --> 00:06:25,219 And that idea arrived and 153 00:06:25,220 --> 00:06:27,199 changed things almost from one day to the 154 00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:28,200 next. 155 00:06:28,940 --> 00:06:31,129 But what's important for this, for us 156 00:06:31,130 --> 00:06:33,319 with that crusade is that it took 157 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:35,809 one form and one form only 158 00:06:35,810 --> 00:06:37,549 surveillance. 159 00:06:37,550 --> 00:06:40,669 But this said was a domesticated 160 00:06:40,670 --> 00:06:42,979 masturbators should be watched. 161 00:06:42,980 --> 00:06:45,139 They should be watched constantly 162 00:06:45,140 --> 00:06:47,269 until their bad habits, their bad habit 163 00:06:47,270 --> 00:06:49,489 was crushed and until they would go back 164 00:06:49,490 --> 00:06:51,259 to normal behavior, meaning not 165 00:06:51,260 --> 00:06:52,260 masturbating. 166 00:06:53,570 --> 00:06:56,899 So structurally, if not technologically, 167 00:06:56,900 --> 00:06:58,399 18th century surveillance 168 00:07:00,440 --> 00:07:02,719 is very similar to today's digital 169 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:03,720 servant. 170 00:07:04,610 --> 00:07:06,679 Another crucial resemblance that they 171 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:08,839 have is that they're both 172 00:07:08,840 --> 00:07:09,840 multipolar. 173 00:07:10,940 --> 00:07:12,409 So you know why today surveillance is 174 00:07:12,410 --> 00:07:14,509 multipolar. We have on one side 175 00:07:14,510 --> 00:07:16,369 states of an interstate agencies. 176 00:07:16,370 --> 00:07:17,629 We have on the other side private 177 00:07:17,630 --> 00:07:20,179 surveillance with all the Jeffares 178 00:07:20,180 --> 00:07:22,549 with Internet 179 00:07:22,550 --> 00:07:23,839 telecom companies. 180 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:26,239 And we have a third role today, 181 00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:28,609 which is us, us 182 00:07:28,610 --> 00:07:31,099 who participate willingly or not 183 00:07:31,100 --> 00:07:33,079 by giving out our data every day when we 184 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:35,179 use technology and in the 18th 185 00:07:35,180 --> 00:07:36,859 century. So when it is also multipolar 186 00:07:36,860 --> 00:07:38,929 because masturbators I watched 187 00:07:38,930 --> 00:07:41,059 by their priests, their watch 188 00:07:41,060 --> 00:07:43,219 by the doctors and their watch by 189 00:07:43,220 --> 00:07:44,220 their family. 190 00:07:47,170 --> 00:07:49,549 So let's start to talk about doctors, 191 00:07:49,550 --> 00:07:51,399 so as I said, they are the ones who 192 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:53,589 started the crusade against masturbation 193 00:07:53,590 --> 00:07:55,720 following the ANANYA tracks that I just 194 00:07:56,740 --> 00:07:57,699 showed you. 195 00:07:57,700 --> 00:07:59,469 Many other doctors across Europe and 196 00:07:59,470 --> 00:08:02,019 especially in France and Germany, 197 00:08:02,020 --> 00:08:04,059 published medical medical treatises, 198 00:08:04,060 --> 00:08:05,649 other tracks that explain that 199 00:08:05,650 --> 00:08:07,869 masturbation was not only a disease, it 200 00:08:07,870 --> 00:08:09,879 was also the cause, the origin or in 201 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:12,189 medical terms, the etiology of 202 00:08:12,190 --> 00:08:14,319 all other diseases that 203 00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:15,459 could exist at all. 204 00:08:15,460 --> 00:08:17,679 Possible disease could eventually be 205 00:08:17,680 --> 00:08:19,389 provoked by masturbation. 206 00:08:21,010 --> 00:08:23,319 So if you masturbated, 207 00:08:23,320 --> 00:08:26,169 doctor said, you would get sick, 208 00:08:26,170 --> 00:08:28,419 your body would degenerate 209 00:08:28,420 --> 00:08:30,279 and you would eventually die in horrible 210 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:32,379 suffering like your skin would. 211 00:08:34,419 --> 00:08:36,909 So these images actually 212 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:40,058 show very well to type of long 213 00:08:40,059 --> 00:08:41,979 term effects of masturbation. 214 00:08:41,980 --> 00:08:44,079 So you see that even a 16 year 215 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:46,839 old on the top left who masturbates 216 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:48,519 is actually sort of degenerates who looks 217 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:49,570 completely stupid. 218 00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:53,589 And so basically, 219 00:08:53,590 --> 00:08:56,019 for doctors at the time, preventing 220 00:08:56,020 --> 00:08:58,239 masturbation was actually a 221 00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:00,399 matter of life and death. 222 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:02,799 You know, the masturbators, therefore, 223 00:09:02,800 --> 00:09:05,409 had to be watched for their own good, 224 00:09:05,410 --> 00:09:07,539 for their own safety, for their own 225 00:09:07,540 --> 00:09:08,540 security. 226 00:09:10,180 --> 00:09:12,189 And those doctors, they convinced the 227 00:09:12,190 --> 00:09:14,259 parents in a family that they had to 228 00:09:14,260 --> 00:09:17,019 put in place inside their homes 229 00:09:17,020 --> 00:09:19,989 a very pervasive type of surveillance 230 00:09:19,990 --> 00:09:21,819 in order to make sure that the children, 231 00:09:21,820 --> 00:09:23,469 the adolescents of the house and the 232 00:09:23,470 --> 00:09:25,419 young adults would not touch themselves. 233 00:09:26,980 --> 00:09:29,079 So there were guide guidebooks that 234 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:30,609 are written and published for the good 235 00:09:30,610 --> 00:09:32,829 family men such as this one published 236 00:09:32,830 --> 00:09:34,979 by a French Dr. John Batiste d'Aboville 237 00:09:36,010 --> 00:09:38,049 that says, I'm translating the title, The 238 00:09:38,050 --> 00:09:40,599 Memento of a father, an educator 239 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:42,729 or intimate advice on the dangers of 240 00:09:42,730 --> 00:09:43,719 masturbation. 241 00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:46,029 And there's also a very nice telling 242 00:09:46,030 --> 00:09:48,159 subtitle on the bottom of the page that 243 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:51,459 says, Masturbation exhausts, 244 00:09:51,460 --> 00:09:53,829 it irritates, it bastardizes 245 00:09:53,830 --> 00:09:55,299 whatever that means. 246 00:09:55,300 --> 00:09:57,129 It does the mind this organizes and 247 00:09:57,130 --> 00:09:58,130 kills. 248 00:09:59,710 --> 00:10:01,749 They also the doctors were recommending 249 00:10:01,750 --> 00:10:03,849 using corsets as this one, 250 00:10:03,850 --> 00:10:05,830 the part of the genital is in metal. 251 00:10:08,170 --> 00:10:09,170 And they also 252 00:10:10,540 --> 00:10:12,189 say that you should wear that for a whole 253 00:10:12,190 --> 00:10:13,659 week and then just take it wants to wash 254 00:10:13,660 --> 00:10:16,269 it. They are also recommending using 255 00:10:16,270 --> 00:10:18,369 cross tying children on a cross in their 256 00:10:18,370 --> 00:10:20,499 bed to make sure that the hands 257 00:10:20,500 --> 00:10:21,669 could never touch the body. 258 00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:26,529 And the hips were also put together so 259 00:10:26,530 --> 00:10:27,789 the legs could not be spread. 260 00:10:27,790 --> 00:10:29,499 That this is a more modern version that I 261 00:10:29,500 --> 00:10:31,249 found on Google, but it actually exists. 262 00:10:31,250 --> 00:10:33,429 And there were also also all type 263 00:10:33,430 --> 00:10:35,559 of, you know, very inventive techniques, 264 00:10:35,560 --> 00:10:37,839 like, for example, attaching 265 00:10:37,840 --> 00:10:40,149 a string that would connect 266 00:10:40,150 --> 00:10:41,439 the children's hands with the little 267 00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:43,749 bells on it to the father's hand 268 00:10:43,750 --> 00:10:45,199 or to his brothers and sisters. 269 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:46,959 And so when he moved, when he would move 270 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:49,119 his hand at night, you know, it would 271 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:50,949 wake the other people in the household 272 00:10:50,950 --> 00:10:51,950 wake up. 273 00:10:54,070 --> 00:10:56,349 So basically what was happening 274 00:10:56,350 --> 00:10:58,419 in these homes in Europe 275 00:10:58,420 --> 00:11:00,759 in the 18th century was 276 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:02,379 a surveillance culture with where 277 00:11:02,380 --> 00:11:03,999 everybody was encouraged to watch 278 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:05,979 everybody. The children would watch each 279 00:11:05,980 --> 00:11:07,449 other, the parents would watch the 280 00:11:07,450 --> 00:11:08,450 children. 281 00:11:09,220 --> 00:11:12,249 And then what about the priests? 282 00:11:12,250 --> 00:11:14,349 So, as I said, surprisingly, at 283 00:11:14,350 --> 00:11:16,449 least for me, it's not the priests who 284 00:11:16,450 --> 00:11:17,529 started that crusade against 285 00:11:17,530 --> 00:11:19,509 masturbation, but they still played a 286 00:11:19,510 --> 00:11:21,900 very crucial role in 287 00:11:22,910 --> 00:11:23,910 in this crusade. 288 00:11:25,300 --> 00:11:27,340 In fact, by the 18th century, 289 00:11:28,690 --> 00:11:31,179 the Catholic Church had completely 290 00:11:31,180 --> 00:11:33,999 reformulated its understanding 291 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:35,290 of the sin of the flesh. 292 00:11:36,310 --> 00:11:38,559 Originally, the sin of the flesh, 293 00:11:38,560 --> 00:11:40,629 which is the Sixth Amendment, was 294 00:11:40,630 --> 00:11:42,880 referring to very specific rules 295 00:11:44,170 --> 00:11:46,539 to very specific infringed infringement 296 00:11:46,540 --> 00:11:47,739 of sexual rules. 297 00:11:47,740 --> 00:11:49,479 For example, you should not commit 298 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:50,409 adultery. 299 00:11:50,410 --> 00:11:51,579 You should not commit incest. 300 00:11:51,580 --> 00:11:53,739 You should not have sex 301 00:11:53,740 --> 00:11:54,740 with animals. 302 00:11:56,420 --> 00:11:58,549 But between the 16th and 18th 303 00:11:58,550 --> 00:12:00,739 century, so after the Catholic 304 00:12:00,740 --> 00:12:02,959 reform, the priest 305 00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:05,299 started to be more and more interested 306 00:12:05,300 --> 00:12:07,999 in the body itself. 307 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:10,219 So it was no longer so much about the 308 00:12:10,220 --> 00:12:11,899 acts that you committed. 309 00:12:11,900 --> 00:12:14,029 So whether or not you fornicated 310 00:12:14,030 --> 00:12:16,309 slept with animals, but it was more about 311 00:12:16,310 --> 00:12:19,249 the sensations that you might have had 312 00:12:19,250 --> 00:12:22,219 even if you didn't commit any fault. 313 00:12:22,220 --> 00:12:24,289 So to give you an example, 314 00:12:26,330 --> 00:12:28,639 the priests would inquire 315 00:12:28,640 --> 00:12:30,769 about the way a young woman 316 00:12:30,770 --> 00:12:32,390 built into a fresh pair. 317 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:36,719 Was the boat too sensual, 318 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:39,029 was the boat too languorous, 319 00:12:39,030 --> 00:12:42,299 did biting on that pier give her 320 00:12:42,300 --> 00:12:44,429 a sort of arousing pleasure that 321 00:12:44,430 --> 00:12:46,529 she should not allow herself to have or 322 00:12:46,530 --> 00:12:47,969 to feel? 323 00:12:47,970 --> 00:12:50,369 So you see, it's not at all about sex 324 00:12:50,370 --> 00:12:51,370 anymore. 325 00:12:51,900 --> 00:12:54,360 But about auto eroticism. 326 00:12:55,630 --> 00:12:58,359 It's about the body as 327 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:01,089 a potential infinite source of pleasure 328 00:13:01,090 --> 00:13:03,189 and desire and as Fuku 329 00:13:03,190 --> 00:13:04,879 puts it, but it's really about as 330 00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:05,880 Mestrovic. 331 00:13:07,030 --> 00:13:09,189 And so the priest were told during 332 00:13:09,190 --> 00:13:11,229 the seminars that what they should really 333 00:13:11,230 --> 00:13:12,729 inquire about, the questions they should 334 00:13:12,730 --> 00:13:15,309 ask was not only to avow 335 00:13:15,310 --> 00:13:18,099 your fault, but it should be 336 00:13:18,100 --> 00:13:19,899 about the thoughts that were formed in 337 00:13:19,900 --> 00:13:22,029 your head, about the images 338 00:13:22,030 --> 00:13:23,919 that came to your mind and about the 339 00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:26,499 sensations that these images provoked. 340 00:13:27,980 --> 00:13:30,140 So really, it was a form of surveillance, 341 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:33,769 there was a confession 342 00:13:33,770 --> 00:13:35,869 of ones of all of one's 343 00:13:35,870 --> 00:13:37,159 acts and thoughts. 344 00:13:39,530 --> 00:13:41,929 And now if I just strike 345 00:13:41,930 --> 00:13:44,089 out strike at the 18th 346 00:13:44,090 --> 00:13:46,099 century actors and this beautiful diagram 347 00:13:46,100 --> 00:13:48,259 and replace it with today's 348 00:13:48,260 --> 00:13:50,359 actors of digital surveillance, 349 00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:53,029 you see that the mechanisms in place 350 00:13:53,030 --> 00:13:54,729 are exactly the same. 351 00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:58,129 Both are done in the name of security. 352 00:13:59,690 --> 00:14:01,669 By someone responsible for your safety, 353 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:04,879 but most of the actual information that 354 00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:07,189 is gathered is gathered by actually 355 00:14:07,190 --> 00:14:09,949 a third act or a third party 356 00:14:09,950 --> 00:14:12,139 in the form of regular, 357 00:14:12,140 --> 00:14:14,239 maybe even daily 358 00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:15,759 complete confession of your actions. 359 00:14:16,820 --> 00:14:18,919 And in both cases, the surveillance is 360 00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:21,799 constant because it is fed 361 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:24,229 by us, by the people who willingly 362 00:14:24,230 --> 00:14:25,309 participate in it. 363 00:14:29,010 --> 00:14:31,379 So I started 364 00:14:31,380 --> 00:14:33,659 by telling you that surveillance 365 00:14:33,660 --> 00:14:35,309 of the masturbators in the 18th century 366 00:14:35,310 --> 00:14:37,739 and digital surveillance today are both 367 00:14:37,740 --> 00:14:39,240 arbitrary and ineffective. 368 00:14:40,830 --> 00:14:43,019 What I meant by ineffective is 369 00:14:43,020 --> 00:14:45,569 that pervasive surveillance 370 00:14:45,570 --> 00:14:47,129 in the 18th century never stopped 371 00:14:47,130 --> 00:14:49,289 masturbation, just as 372 00:14:49,290 --> 00:14:50,939 mass surveillance never stopped a 373 00:14:50,940 --> 00:14:51,940 terrorist. 374 00:15:00,230 --> 00:15:02,329 So you probably have more data 375 00:15:02,330 --> 00:15:04,189 than I do on Mr. Vincent terrorists, but 376 00:15:04,190 --> 00:15:06,259 last time I checked on my data is from 377 00:15:06,260 --> 00:15:08,599 2015 to bulk collection programs 378 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:10,669 of the NSA has never been efficient 379 00:15:10,670 --> 00:15:13,219 in preventing any terror attack. 380 00:15:13,220 --> 00:15:14,569 Now, there's still a question that 381 00:15:14,570 --> 00:15:16,099 remains, at least for me, is do the 382 00:15:16,100 --> 00:15:17,959 people who work at the NSA end this bulk 383 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:19,249 collection program? Do they really 384 00:15:19,250 --> 00:15:21,259 believe they they work? 385 00:15:21,260 --> 00:15:23,389 Because what's for sure is that 386 00:15:23,390 --> 00:15:25,669 in the 18th century, the doctors 387 00:15:25,670 --> 00:15:27,529 who worked on that sort of anti 388 00:15:27,530 --> 00:15:29,719 masturbation surveillance, they 389 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:31,819 knew they really knew it didn't 390 00:15:31,820 --> 00:15:33,889 work. They even admitted it in some 391 00:15:33,890 --> 00:15:34,819 treatises. 392 00:15:34,820 --> 00:15:37,669 They wrote down that actually 393 00:15:37,670 --> 00:15:39,469 none of those measures that I told you 394 00:15:39,470 --> 00:15:41,029 about were efficient. 395 00:15:41,030 --> 00:15:43,009 The only radical solution would be to 396 00:15:43,010 --> 00:15:45,109 excise women and to 397 00:15:45,110 --> 00:15:47,629 torture men by injecting baking 398 00:15:47,630 --> 00:15:50,419 soda into the urinary tract. 399 00:15:50,420 --> 00:15:51,420 But 400 00:15:52,510 --> 00:15:54,649 but they agreed that it was not really 401 00:15:54,650 --> 00:15:56,330 a plausible or nice solution 402 00:15:58,580 --> 00:15:59,580 yet. 403 00:16:00,470 --> 00:16:02,179 Even if they knew everything they were 404 00:16:02,180 --> 00:16:03,349 doing and saying was completely 405 00:16:03,350 --> 00:16:05,629 inefficient, ineffective, 406 00:16:05,630 --> 00:16:07,609 they still kept playing the game, they 407 00:16:07,610 --> 00:16:10,339 still kept leading 408 00:16:10,340 --> 00:16:11,990 the crusade against masturbation. 409 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:16,929 And the question is why? 410 00:16:19,020 --> 00:16:21,299 So there's a very simplistic 411 00:16:21,300 --> 00:16:22,300 answer. 412 00:16:24,260 --> 00:16:25,729 It's because they were making money with 413 00:16:25,730 --> 00:16:27,859 new patients coming in with a new 414 00:16:27,860 --> 00:16:29,000 disease, masturbation, 415 00:16:30,140 --> 00:16:32,569 but it's not only that, 416 00:16:32,570 --> 00:16:34,699 obviously there were 417 00:16:34,700 --> 00:16:36,710 also applying 418 00:16:37,910 --> 00:16:40,969 the new and pervasive 419 00:16:40,970 --> 00:16:43,129 economic logic of the time. 420 00:16:43,130 --> 00:16:44,359 They were simply acting 421 00:16:45,500 --> 00:16:46,359 sorry I. 422 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:47,299 The slide. 423 00:16:47,300 --> 00:16:49,759 Were simply acting as Russell 424 00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:52,759 Marcuse or highish argue, 425 00:16:52,760 --> 00:16:54,889 as the first sons of capitalism. 426 00:16:56,840 --> 00:16:59,219 In fact, the 18th century was also 427 00:16:59,220 --> 00:17:01,639 the time when economic liberalism 428 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:03,049 was born. 429 00:17:03,050 --> 00:17:05,568 And with it, the human body 430 00:17:05,569 --> 00:17:07,249 was supposed to become a tool of 431 00:17:07,250 --> 00:17:09,559 performance and 432 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:11,149 an instrument of productivity. 433 00:17:13,460 --> 00:17:15,799 And Thomas Laqueur, which is an American 434 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:17,749 contemporary philosopher, goes even 435 00:17:17,750 --> 00:17:19,068 further. 436 00:17:19,069 --> 00:17:21,588 And he says the reason 437 00:17:21,589 --> 00:17:23,779 why masturbation became such a huge 438 00:17:23,780 --> 00:17:25,879 problem in the 18th century is 439 00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:27,979 because it contradicted the very 440 00:17:27,980 --> 00:17:30,289 principle of economic liberalism, 441 00:17:30,290 --> 00:17:33,169 which is that private Vyse 442 00:17:33,170 --> 00:17:35,329 is always translated into public 443 00:17:35,330 --> 00:17:37,549 virtue if it goes through 444 00:17:37,550 --> 00:17:39,739 commerce, if it goes through the trade 445 00:17:39,740 --> 00:17:40,669 with the other. 446 00:17:40,670 --> 00:17:42,889 And obviously masturbation is by 447 00:17:42,890 --> 00:17:45,289 definition the human activity 448 00:17:45,290 --> 00:17:47,449 that excludes 449 00:17:47,450 --> 00:17:49,489 the other or any type of commerce with 450 00:17:49,490 --> 00:17:50,490 other. 451 00:17:51,630 --> 00:17:53,849 And this liberal principle, 452 00:17:55,230 --> 00:17:57,749 so the virtue of trade, 453 00:17:57,750 --> 00:17:59,639 of course, still applies today, maybe the 454 00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:00,959 place today more than ever. 455 00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:05,109 It's in fact, at the core 456 00:18:05,110 --> 00:18:06,339 of the digital surveillance, 457 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:10,419 because we are so inured 458 00:18:10,420 --> 00:18:12,459 to the liberal economy, we don't even 459 00:18:12,460 --> 00:18:14,769 realize anymore, but we have 460 00:18:14,770 --> 00:18:17,019 applied market rationalities to 461 00:18:17,020 --> 00:18:19,479 every single facets of our life. 462 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:21,159 In fact, the only reason why digital 463 00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,289 surveillance is possible is because we 464 00:18:23,290 --> 00:18:25,479 consider everything, including our 465 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:27,969 privacy, as a good 466 00:18:27,970 --> 00:18:30,399 as a commodity that could eventually 467 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:32,019 be traded for about. 468 00:18:36,740 --> 00:18:39,500 However, despite 469 00:18:40,610 --> 00:18:42,439 the great similarities between Asian 470 00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:44,959 century of 471 00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:47,989 surveillance of the masturbators 472 00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:50,269 and today's digital surveillance, there's 473 00:18:50,270 --> 00:18:51,829 one crucial difference. 474 00:18:54,270 --> 00:18:56,549 In the 18th century, both 475 00:18:56,550 --> 00:18:59,069 doctors and priests agreed 476 00:18:59,070 --> 00:19:01,199 that in order to be cured or to 477 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,329 be forgiven, the masturbator 478 00:19:03,330 --> 00:19:04,380 had to confess. 479 00:19:05,940 --> 00:19:07,529 It had to confess to the priest, to the 480 00:19:07,530 --> 00:19:09,839 doctor, and preferably to both. 481 00:19:11,100 --> 00:19:13,769 But confession was really meant as 482 00:19:13,770 --> 00:19:15,309 a relief of the soul. 483 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,019 It forced the subject to 484 00:19:19,020 --> 00:19:21,419 reflect on himself, to have an extremely 485 00:19:21,420 --> 00:19:23,160 active relationship to himself, 486 00:19:24,750 --> 00:19:26,939 to develop what Fuyuko 487 00:19:26,940 --> 00:19:29,009 calls an internal gaze, 488 00:19:29,010 --> 00:19:31,410 meaning to watch his own thoughts, 489 00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:33,839 to watch his own feelings. 490 00:19:35,650 --> 00:19:37,629 And, of course, the mandatory confession 491 00:19:37,630 --> 00:19:39,399 that was imposed to everyone in the 18th 492 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:41,889 century often had a counterproductive 493 00:19:41,890 --> 00:19:43,509 effect because it produced guilt and 494 00:19:43,510 --> 00:19:46,329 produced self-censorship, not necessarily 495 00:19:46,330 --> 00:19:48,639 a flourishing internal case, 496 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:50,919 but at least the confession of the 18th 497 00:19:50,920 --> 00:19:53,169 century had one merit 498 00:19:53,170 --> 00:19:56,109 is that they let the subject 499 00:19:56,110 --> 00:19:58,299 speak for himself and 500 00:19:58,300 --> 00:20:00,099 create his own narrative of himself. 501 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:03,709 And today, when Siva Vaidhyanathan, 502 00:20:03,710 --> 00:20:05,179 who wrote a great book called The 503 00:20:05,180 --> 00:20:07,519 Googlization of Everything, writes 504 00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:09,769 that to search for something on the Web 505 00:20:09,770 --> 00:20:12,109 using Google is not unlike confessing 506 00:20:12,110 --> 00:20:14,299 your desire to a mysterious power. 507 00:20:14,300 --> 00:20:15,619 Well, that's how he makes a very 508 00:20:15,620 --> 00:20:17,389 compelling point by saying that. 509 00:20:17,390 --> 00:20:19,669 But he also misses an essential 510 00:20:19,670 --> 00:20:21,929 difference in today's 511 00:20:21,930 --> 00:20:22,930 surveillance. 512 00:20:23,990 --> 00:20:26,059 There's no such thing as a confession in 513 00:20:26,060 --> 00:20:27,680 a Christian sense of the term. 514 00:20:29,030 --> 00:20:31,039 We may well be laying out all of our 515 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:33,889 desires, intimate 516 00:20:33,890 --> 00:20:35,959 hopes and fears on 517 00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:37,849 the Google search box that 518 00:20:38,900 --> 00:20:40,999 first, very often we don't 519 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:43,399 do it willingly, meaning 520 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:44,899 we don't mean to confess them when we 521 00:20:44,900 --> 00:20:46,879 type in Google, we just typing. 522 00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:48,900 We just really searching for something. 523 00:20:49,970 --> 00:20:52,069 And second, we don't reflect on 524 00:20:52,070 --> 00:20:54,309 them or on ourselves when we do so. 525 00:20:55,550 --> 00:20:57,679 And third, some of us, 526 00:20:57,680 --> 00:20:59,839 maybe even most of us, are not even 527 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:02,059 aware that when we do 528 00:21:02,060 --> 00:21:04,309 so, when we type on Google, 529 00:21:04,310 --> 00:21:06,649 there's a mysterious power, 530 00:21:06,650 --> 00:21:08,779 as he calls it, 531 00:21:08,780 --> 00:21:10,789 that might be listening or reading 532 00:21:10,790 --> 00:21:11,790 confession. 533 00:21:12,890 --> 00:21:15,499 So Google certainly 534 00:21:15,500 --> 00:21:18,019 has a similar power 535 00:21:18,020 --> 00:21:19,999 and probably a much better knowledge of 536 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:22,099 who we are than the priests 537 00:21:22,100 --> 00:21:23,180 of the 18th century. 538 00:21:24,500 --> 00:21:26,060 But we as subjects 539 00:21:27,110 --> 00:21:29,599 have mostly abandoned the internal 540 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:31,819 gaze that I was telling you about, 541 00:21:31,820 --> 00:21:34,189 this foundational relationship 542 00:21:34,190 --> 00:21:36,739 with oneself that comes with conscious 543 00:21:36,740 --> 00:21:37,740 confession. 544 00:21:39,860 --> 00:21:41,839 So as a conclusion, 545 00:21:43,610 --> 00:21:44,690 I want to suggest. 546 00:21:46,290 --> 00:21:48,719 Why, to me, this comparison 547 00:21:48,720 --> 00:21:51,069 with 18th century crusade 548 00:21:51,070 --> 00:21:53,669 on masturbators is meaningful 549 00:21:53,670 --> 00:21:55,859 and not merely titillating or just funny. 550 00:22:00,300 --> 00:22:01,589 I've always felt that. 551 00:22:02,890 --> 00:22:05,589 What is really at stake with surveillance 552 00:22:05,590 --> 00:22:07,509 and not only targeted surveillance, but 553 00:22:08,890 --> 00:22:10,719 bulk data collection, mass data 554 00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:11,949 collection? 555 00:22:11,950 --> 00:22:13,059 What's really at stake with that 556 00:22:13,060 --> 00:22:14,469 surveillance is the self. 557 00:22:15,740 --> 00:22:18,109 This very little black 558 00:22:18,110 --> 00:22:19,789 box that we all have inside and that 559 00:22:19,790 --> 00:22:22,099 humanists believe 560 00:22:22,100 --> 00:22:24,319 it should remain untouched, should 561 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:26,690 remain free and should be sanctified. 562 00:22:27,740 --> 00:22:30,079 I really felt that this very inner 563 00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:32,419 self that makes us worthy 564 00:22:32,420 --> 00:22:34,639 human beings, that's 565 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:37,039 what is ultimately at stake 566 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,049 with mass surveillance, and that's why we 567 00:22:39,050 --> 00:22:40,050 should care. 568 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:43,379 But the problem is, and the 569 00:22:43,380 --> 00:22:45,509 difficulty as I have, is 570 00:22:45,510 --> 00:22:47,399 that this argument is extremely difficult 571 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:48,479 to make. 572 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:50,699 I mean, even when I'm talking to 573 00:22:50,700 --> 00:22:52,769 a crowd of philosophers 574 00:22:52,770 --> 00:22:54,959 and I say, you know, using all types 575 00:22:54,960 --> 00:22:56,880 of references, surveillance 576 00:22:58,170 --> 00:23:01,469 changes our relationship to the self. 577 00:23:01,470 --> 00:23:03,989 I mean, of course, some might agree, 578 00:23:03,990 --> 00:23:05,069 but it's actually 579 00:23:06,180 --> 00:23:08,159 nobody really knows what the self is. 580 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:10,589 And so nobody's 581 00:23:10,590 --> 00:23:11,939 moved if I say that. 582 00:23:14,010 --> 00:23:15,299 There's no gut reaction. 583 00:23:17,550 --> 00:23:18,550 And on the other hand, 584 00:23:19,740 --> 00:23:22,049 when we talk about masturbation, 585 00:23:22,050 --> 00:23:23,690 the gut reaction is immediate. 586 00:23:24,930 --> 00:23:27,089 Even if we don't know what the self is, 587 00:23:27,090 --> 00:23:28,529 even if we still don't know what the self 588 00:23:28,530 --> 00:23:30,869 is, the idea 589 00:23:30,870 --> 00:23:32,619 of being watched while masturbating. 590 00:23:32,620 --> 00:23:34,739 And for some of us, just the idea of 591 00:23:34,740 --> 00:23:35,849 masturbation itself 592 00:23:37,260 --> 00:23:39,419 mortified is immediately I mean, we all 593 00:23:39,420 --> 00:23:41,520 we always immediately feels invaded. 594 00:23:43,350 --> 00:23:45,599 So it's very I understand it's 595 00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:46,619 very easy to understand. 596 00:23:46,620 --> 00:23:48,929 It's revealing masturbation 597 00:23:48,930 --> 00:23:51,479 is the ultimate violation, 598 00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:53,579 not because it's bad 599 00:23:53,580 --> 00:23:55,469 and not because it's shameful, not 600 00:23:55,470 --> 00:23:56,969 because we doing anything wrong if we do 601 00:23:56,970 --> 00:23:59,039 it, but simply 602 00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:01,649 and only because 603 00:24:01,650 --> 00:24:03,779 it is one little part 604 00:24:03,780 --> 00:24:06,130 of that little black box of the self. 605 00:24:07,530 --> 00:24:08,530 Thank you. 606 00:24:19,690 --> 00:24:21,189 Thank you, Charlie. 607 00:24:21,190 --> 00:24:23,079 We have six microphones on ground level 608 00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:24,759 and we have a few minutes for a quick 609 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:26,769 Q&A. So if you have questions, please 610 00:24:26,770 --> 00:24:28,839 line up at the microphones at ground 611 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:31,269 level and 612 00:24:31,270 --> 00:24:32,270 shoot. 613 00:24:32,890 --> 00:24:34,330 Are there any questions? 614 00:24:36,980 --> 00:24:39,109 Yes, we have one microphone number 615 00:24:39,110 --> 00:24:41,269 one, thank you very much for your 616 00:24:41,270 --> 00:24:43,689 talk and I 617 00:24:43,690 --> 00:24:46,159 I want to make a short introduction. 618 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,469 I am Greek and then 619 00:24:48,470 --> 00:24:50,719 in Greek we have a very common insult 620 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:51,649 that is not allowed. 621 00:24:51,650 --> 00:24:52,859 Please keep your questions short. 622 00:24:52,860 --> 00:24:54,979 We have limited Malakas 623 00:24:54,980 --> 00:24:57,019 that means masturbator, and it's a very 624 00:24:57,020 --> 00:24:57,949 common insult. 625 00:24:57,950 --> 00:25:00,259 Maybe stemmed from your time, 626 00:25:00,260 --> 00:25:01,549 the time you described. 627 00:25:01,550 --> 00:25:03,229 So I wanted to ask you about the 628 00:25:03,230 --> 00:25:05,539 geographical place of this 629 00:25:05,540 --> 00:25:08,119 crusade and its relation 630 00:25:08,120 --> 00:25:10,519 in time with its position in time 631 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:12,949 with with the Renaissance 632 00:25:12,950 --> 00:25:15,109 period and the 633 00:25:15,110 --> 00:25:17,419 confession. It was the confessional ready 634 00:25:18,770 --> 00:25:20,719 structure that was in place or it was 635 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:23,410 adopted with this. 636 00:25:25,070 --> 00:25:26,070 Yeah. 637 00:25:26,900 --> 00:25:27,900 So 638 00:25:29,360 --> 00:25:31,129 the crusade actually started not in 639 00:25:31,130 --> 00:25:33,379 Catholic countries, but in protest 640 00:25:33,380 --> 00:25:35,779 in countries. It started in in 641 00:25:35,780 --> 00:25:38,059 England and then in Germany, and 642 00:25:38,060 --> 00:25:40,189 then it moved to France, which was 643 00:25:40,190 --> 00:25:41,450 mostly Catholic at the time. 644 00:25:43,550 --> 00:25:45,469 And so that was really beginning of the 645 00:25:45,470 --> 00:25:47,719 18th century and it lasted until the end 646 00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:48,829 of the 19th century. 647 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:53,869 And when it comes to the 648 00:25:53,870 --> 00:25:54,870 Catholics, 649 00:25:56,690 --> 00:25:59,419 what's really interesting is that both, 650 00:25:59,420 --> 00:26:01,729 you know, the like the medical rational 651 00:26:01,730 --> 00:26:03,979 crusade and 652 00:26:03,980 --> 00:26:05,659 the Catholic Church, they became to be 653 00:26:05,660 --> 00:26:07,039 interested in Trevelyan's. 654 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:08,569 They happened at the same time, but for 655 00:26:08,570 --> 00:26:09,859 different reasons. 656 00:26:09,860 --> 00:26:12,109 So the doctors, as I say, the only 657 00:26:12,110 --> 00:26:13,819 plausible explanation is that the 658 00:26:13,820 --> 00:26:16,159 interior is the new economic 659 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:19,249 approach to life in general, 660 00:26:19,250 --> 00:26:21,379 to science, to rationality, the 661 00:26:21,380 --> 00:26:22,910 Christian priests. On the other hand, 662 00:26:25,220 --> 00:26:27,679 what really change things is 663 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:29,930 the 16th century, the kind of reform 664 00:26:31,630 --> 00:26:33,800 that happened with the Council of Trent. 665 00:26:34,820 --> 00:26:37,009 I think I was 16. 666 00:26:37,010 --> 00:26:37,999 I forgot. Yes. 667 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,609 Anyway, no, fifty, 668 00:26:40,610 --> 00:26:42,109 fifteen, thirty two, I think. 669 00:26:42,110 --> 00:26:43,110 And sort of Trent. 670 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:45,679 And so that, you know, the Christian 671 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:47,899 Church and the Catholic Church had to 672 00:26:47,900 --> 00:26:49,999 reinvent itself after the reform 673 00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:51,289 of the Protestants. 674 00:26:51,290 --> 00:26:53,959 And so the priest 675 00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:56,389 for United and they decided 676 00:26:56,390 --> 00:26:57,829 on new ways to 677 00:26:59,300 --> 00:27:01,969 just exercise their own religion. 678 00:27:01,970 --> 00:27:04,129 And one of the first thing that they 679 00:27:04,130 --> 00:27:06,709 thought of was confession, 680 00:27:06,710 --> 00:27:08,189 to make sure that people were not 681 00:27:08,190 --> 00:27:10,369 participants, that there were not 682 00:27:10,370 --> 00:27:11,569 heretical. 683 00:27:11,570 --> 00:27:13,189 They made sure that confession would 684 00:27:13,190 --> 00:27:16,549 become mandatory and 685 00:27:16,550 --> 00:27:18,799 to be efficient in knowing if people 686 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:20,959 were really good Catholics or not, 687 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:23,059 they could not just ask people as 688 00:27:23,060 --> 00:27:25,399 they had been doing until the 16th 689 00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:27,499 century. Did you commit a false did 690 00:27:27,500 --> 00:27:29,419 you commit a sin because there was not 691 00:27:29,420 --> 00:27:30,420 enough? 692 00:27:31,490 --> 00:27:33,019 They had to know what was going on in 693 00:27:33,020 --> 00:27:34,609 their head, in their mind. 694 00:27:34,610 --> 00:27:36,839 So that's why they transformed 695 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:38,899 confession into not simply 696 00:27:38,900 --> 00:27:41,389 avowing your fault and your sins, 697 00:27:41,390 --> 00:27:44,629 but into speaking 698 00:27:44,630 --> 00:27:45,799 your whole self. 699 00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:47,539 You had to be able, during your 700 00:27:47,540 --> 00:27:50,299 confession to represent your own self, 701 00:27:50,300 --> 00:27:52,369 to to think, reflect on your 702 00:27:52,370 --> 00:27:54,499 whole life, even the the things 703 00:27:54,500 --> 00:27:55,519 that were not false. 704 00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:57,709 Then why not? Since you had to analyze 705 00:27:57,710 --> 00:28:00,139 yourself completely, this is almost, 706 00:28:00,140 --> 00:28:01,190 you know, the beginning of 707 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:03,480 psychoanalysis. 708 00:28:05,940 --> 00:28:08,369 I think we have another question from our 709 00:28:08,370 --> 00:28:10,349 signal angel who was monitoring Iasi on 710 00:28:10,350 --> 00:28:11,249 social media. 711 00:28:11,250 --> 00:28:12,719 Thank you. One question from the 712 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:14,709 Internet. Do you think that the 713 00:28:14,710 --> 00:28:16,949 surveillance and self regulation 714 00:28:16,950 --> 00:28:19,229 will become normal as government 715 00:28:19,230 --> 00:28:21,329 realizes that we are no longer 716 00:28:21,330 --> 00:28:23,519 ungovernable by their, 717 00:28:24,530 --> 00:28:26,670 you know, conventional means? 718 00:28:29,490 --> 00:28:31,489 I almost want to answer another question 719 00:28:32,630 --> 00:28:34,699 if cell surveillance really 720 00:28:34,700 --> 00:28:36,799 becomes the norm and if 721 00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:39,440 we self surveil ourself, uh. 722 00:28:40,490 --> 00:28:42,529 With the norms that are imposed upon us, 723 00:28:42,530 --> 00:28:44,029 then, of course, we don't need to be 724 00:28:44,030 --> 00:28:46,159 governed, governed by any other type of 725 00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:47,869 government. I think that's you know, 726 00:28:47,870 --> 00:28:49,369 that's one of the key arguments of 727 00:28:49,370 --> 00:28:50,539 totalitarian regimes. 728 00:28:51,650 --> 00:28:53,809 The point of any totalitarian 729 00:28:53,810 --> 00:28:56,419 regime is to not even need to 730 00:28:56,420 --> 00:28:58,669 exercise any power except exert 731 00:28:58,670 --> 00:29:00,229 any power upon the people because they'll 732 00:29:00,230 --> 00:29:01,230 just do it themselves. 733 00:29:03,650 --> 00:29:05,569 Next question from microphone number 734 00:29:05,570 --> 00:29:06,839 three. 735 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:08,509 Hi, thanks for the talk. 736 00:29:08,510 --> 00:29:09,649 I have a question. 737 00:29:09,650 --> 00:29:11,719 You talked about the 738 00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:13,459 when I go to the priest and I confessed 739 00:29:13,460 --> 00:29:14,869 my sins, then I tell a story about 740 00:29:14,870 --> 00:29:15,829 myself. 741 00:29:15,830 --> 00:29:19,279 And when Google is telling my story 742 00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:21,859 so I don't have my own 743 00:29:21,860 --> 00:29:24,079 toll with narrative me, it's 744 00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:25,639 my Google told narrative me. 745 00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:27,140 How does this affect my blackbox? 746 00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:29,920 Well. 747 00:29:33,170 --> 00:29:34,170 You know, it's very. 748 00:29:37,710 --> 00:29:39,839 I'm trying to think of the best example 749 00:29:42,540 --> 00:29:44,849 for just, you know, if I just gather 750 00:29:44,850 --> 00:29:46,949 the metadata that I get about you for the 751 00:29:46,950 --> 00:29:49,079 next three days, for 752 00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:51,209 the for the sorry, for the last three 753 00:29:51,210 --> 00:29:52,799 days, I gather the metadata about you, 754 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:54,119 your Google search, where you went, your 755 00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:55,679 GPS, etc. 756 00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:57,779 Anyone can probably picture 757 00:29:57,780 --> 00:29:59,880 you as a crazy person, 758 00:30:01,980 --> 00:30:04,139 as a criminal or as 759 00:30:04,140 --> 00:30:06,089 a, you know, just the person you are not 760 00:30:06,090 --> 00:30:08,609 because we can make this data talking, 761 00:30:08,610 --> 00:30:11,040 you know, any way possible. 762 00:30:12,170 --> 00:30:13,859 And this actually is happening in certain 763 00:30:13,860 --> 00:30:14,949 courts. 764 00:30:14,950 --> 00:30:17,609 You know, the metadata becomes 765 00:30:17,610 --> 00:30:19,919 used as a proof of 766 00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:21,989 as an evidence of who you are and 767 00:30:21,990 --> 00:30:24,299 what you did and against the data 768 00:30:24,300 --> 00:30:26,489 that is so easily readable, you 769 00:30:26,490 --> 00:30:28,079 can't really defend yourself. 770 00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:30,419 Your own word has 771 00:30:30,420 --> 00:30:33,089 less power and 772 00:30:33,090 --> 00:30:35,279 is considered less truth than the 773 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:37,409 data that is officially 774 00:30:37,410 --> 00:30:39,839 gathered black and white on paper. 775 00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:41,999 And it's, I think, 776 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,789 extremely violent to not be able 777 00:30:44,790 --> 00:30:47,579 to tell who you are yourself. 778 00:30:47,580 --> 00:30:49,709 It's extremely violent to 779 00:30:49,710 --> 00:30:52,559 be confronted to that double, 780 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:54,599 you know, that data double of us 781 00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:58,799 that speaks louder than we could ever 782 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:00,329 speak ourselves. 783 00:31:00,330 --> 00:31:02,189 So I think that's that's the violation of 784 00:31:02,190 --> 00:31:05,219 the little black box that you can be 785 00:31:05,220 --> 00:31:07,469 you can be convinced of what is 786 00:31:07,470 --> 00:31:09,329 into your little black box. 787 00:31:09,330 --> 00:31:11,009 You can maybe not be even sure, because I 788 00:31:11,010 --> 00:31:12,449 think no one is really sure. 789 00:31:12,450 --> 00:31:15,179 But I mean, until now, 790 00:31:15,180 --> 00:31:17,399 you know, you always had 791 00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:19,529 the possibility to let 792 00:31:19,530 --> 00:31:22,139 it talk and let it speak, you know 793 00:31:22,140 --> 00:31:23,309 as well as you could. 794 00:31:25,300 --> 00:31:27,489 Narrate your own story yourself, 795 00:31:27,490 --> 00:31:30,069 and the existence of those data doubles 796 00:31:30,070 --> 00:31:32,139 forbids that or it doesn't forbid it, 797 00:31:32,140 --> 00:31:34,419 but it makes it very complicated 798 00:31:34,420 --> 00:31:36,669 to be taken seriously when 799 00:31:36,670 --> 00:31:38,109 we have that existing double. 800 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:43,099 Thank you very much, Charlene Biondi, 801 00:31:43,100 --> 00:31:45,289 we're sadly out of time again. 802 00:31:45,290 --> 00:31:46,970 Please give her a warm round of applause.